First Law Discussion

[rlortie]

A flywheel will not turn without force being added to it. :-)

[Trevor Lyn Whatford]

Hi preoccupied.

Yes that would be me, I just do not stop learning. Mistakes are one of the best learning tools and I have made thousands of them. The principle is not bad it is just the mechanical application that is difficult as with most designs!

Regards Trevor

[preoccupied]

Rlortie, do you like my contribution to the discussion? I know you were losing patience with Jim_Mich because he doesn't show details to his intellectual property so I've shared mine publicly for the first time.

A flywheel will not turn without force being added to it. INDEED! Do you think there is force from the extra velocity of the longer path moving to the shorter path? What is Maxwell's demon other than conveniently placed forces? If I change paths from a longer path to a shorter path, does not the velocity exchange to the shorter path? If this works the way I intend does this extra energy always lay dormant when gravity is used against any axle, if there is extra energy to exchange? Isn't this just like Maxwell's demon?

[Trevor Lyn Whatford]

Hi preoccupied,

My Maxwell diamond design was a lot more simple. I had a mercury filled piston that drove two clocks one on the up stoke and one on the down stroke, or both together when the clocks had duel ratchets and spring set ups, attached to the piston was a toothed slider to drive the clock winder ratchets.

Regards Trevor

Edit, sorry about the Pun!

[preoccupied]

Maxwell "diamond" LOL

[preoccupied]

I guess I want to put it this way. I think ectropy is automatically lost when a weight is on a lever. From gravities perspective something pushing on an axle is possibly lighter to gravity (if my idea works as I intend). Then I create ectropy because some ectropy was already lost, I just regained what was automatically lost. Entropy would have to compete with regained ectropy to create perpetual motion. I hope I'm using these terms correctly...

[eccentrically1]

The energy comes from the universe.

That is ambiguous.

Kinetic energy is the result of an energy conversion. If your ugly baby doesn't convert some form of energy to kinetic energy, it's not going to have any motion, much less perpetual motion.
Mass doesn't have kinetic energy, it only has potential energy. The forms of energy you can convert your mass to depend on what mass you are starting with.
If we had a mass of lead, or two or eight or sixteen,we can give them kinetic energy by raising them in our gravity, but they won't create more kinetic energy because we place them in a rotating environment. A wheel and axle is only a lever, nothing more.

If you were inside a big wheel you can turn the wheel by walking up the rim.
Can lead weights walk uphill? No.
And that's a fact.
I'm not wrong.

[ovyyus]

I'm simply trying to break the discussion down to its most basic components.

Great. Your engine energy source is its most basic component. Why not discuss that? Work is not done by magic.

[preoccupied]

ovyyus you're right work is not done by magic. I would love Jim_Mich to show more details about his idea. I think it would be very interesting. While I'm explaining my idea if it works the way I intend I'm inclined to believe it's possible from gravities perspective energy is lost and goes nowhere when something is put onto leverage and that lost energy can be regained because gravity wishes to give it more force than it's getting.

[murilo]

preoccc,
you should love Jim much more, since he is not a fan and indeed against avalanchedrive... 8[

[preoccupied]

Jim_Mich,
If you let inertia of the two weights pull against each other in your wagon example, I'm imagining the greater force being pulled more to one direction at an angle while the wheel is still moving forward. There is usable energy I'm imagining and it can go somewhere and if it does move as fast as the wagon is already moving then you would be right. I think the change in angle might slow down the wagon but I'm imagining they are connected and moving in different directions. How does the wagon keep going the same speed? I'm not trying to pressure you to share your intellectual property. I think you might be on to something so can you explain further?

Murilo,
I don't know what you're talking about. I don't think the avalanche drive that you promote works.

[murilo]

preoccc,
yes!
Correct!
You don't know and you don't think... much more than you can guess.

If you could be able to understand it, at least, you would be silent and respect to avalanchedrive, without so hard evidence of ignorance and handicapped IQ.

[eccentrically1]

have i kilt another one murl?

[preoccupied]

preoccc,
yes!
Correct!
You don't know and you don't think... much more than you can guess.

If you could be able to understand it, at least, you would be silent and respect to avalanchedrive, without so hard evidence of ignorance and handicapped IQ.

I don't know if that is an insult or not because of your broken English. I don't think you're angry at me. Just to make myself clear, I'm not about to pick a fight with you Murilo. If you insulted me then it's falling on deaf ears. Do you understand the motion wheel I shared? I think it's similar to Maxwell's demon. The fast moving molecule is teleported by two wheels being next to each other. The fast moving molecule is the weight moving faster by being closer to the rim. There is possibly extra energy there further from the rim than a position closer to the axle. Isn't it just like Maxwell's Demon?

[murilo]

Trevor,
Aren't you the guy working on an adaptation to murilo's avalanche drive? Please put extra effort into what you say to me as I might not be as smart as you are. I hope this contributes to the discussion and does not focus on the aspects of my design itself. This is supposed to be about the Maxwell demon. I think my design here that I shared is very similar concept, maybe a parallel of Maxwell demon to gravity wheels.

"1. The lifting of the weights" - The design is supposed to be nearly balanced. It should turn like a flywheel if no force is added to it.

preoccc,
in slow motion and high definition, above is sent what you said picking my person who was quiet under my stone.

Orrrr... is this some kind of language barrier?

I didn't understand your design and I couldn't say any stuff upon.