Another claim to a working device...

[justsomeone]

You are starting with an experiment that prevents any back torque due to the stop. Please explain how this works after it is rotating and the stop is no longer valid.

[Tarsier79]

Grimer, I did do what you said. I captured the pendulum at the peak of its swing, waiting for the compound pendulum to catch up, then pinned the pendulum to the compound pendulum, and there was no energy left in the system to continue rotation.

The problem is, you drop the pendulum, it impacts and bounces back. Between the impact and the point where the compound pendulum rotates into position, it is OB in the wrong direction.

What is happening in sim world: Pendulum drops, imparts KE and converts its remaining KE to PE, where we capture it. The compound pendulum is given KE from the small pendulum, which it then also converts to PE. The PE gained by the compound pendulum is exactly the PE lost by the small pendulum.

What will happen in real world: due to losses, the pendulum will only lift back up 90% at best to the height shown in sim. The imperfect collision means that a reduced amount of KE is transferred to the compound pendulum, which experiences frictions, and doesn't make it to the reset point. Game over.

Real world exception: Our mathematical ability in kinetics does not match real world physics, and a gain appears.... Where do you expect that gain to be? In the initial drop? in the collision? Any suspected gains here should be easy to test in real world conditions with the simplest of equipment.

ADD: Justsomeone, the latching would be able to be overcome with engineering. What wouldn't be able to be overcome is the lack of rotation for reset.

[Grimer]

The above frame from your first video is the closest frame to balanced reset.

As you can see it's pretty damn close especially since we know there are missing frames one of which probably shows perfect reset.

But even if that was the closest we know there is enough energy in the compound pendulum clockwise rotation to achieve reset because the compound pendulum continues to rotate for the next seven or so frames as the simple pendulum descends even though the simple pendulum is destroying the balance and thus acting against the motion of the compound pendulum.

I think I can see where your problem lies. You don't have a facility to step through the video frame by frame do you.

[Grimer]

Our posts crossed.

[Grimer]

Grimer, I did do what you said. I captured the pendulum at the peak of its swing, waiting for the compound pendulum to catch up, then pinned the pendulum to the compound pendulum, and there was no energy left in the system to continue rotation.
...

Wrong. If you step through the first video frame by frame you will see that there is energy left.

Justsomeone, the latching would be able to be overcome with engineering.

Well, you got that right. ;-)

[Grimer]

"Over the next two years, the Curies undertake to remove the barium from the sample, using a slow crystallization process. On New Year's Eve, the last crystallization is finally complete, and the scientists stare eagerly into the small lab dish, in which they expect to see a chunk of radium. To their great dismay, however, only a stain remains. Marie is crushed by their seeming failure, ....."

If she'd thrown away that dish in disgust she would never have discovered radium.

[Tarsier79]

Grimer, do you have WM2D, a free copy will do. Seems the attachment problem hasn't been resolved just yet. With limited data left for the next few days, I cannot afford to keep posting vids.

I did go back and check the positioning. The explanation above covers it. Watch the vid closely to see the rotation of the compound pendulum sapped by gravity. The position it makes is only just to the reset point: in outer space with perfect bearings and with a perfect impact, after which there is no energy left over for rotation.\

Anyway, pm me if you want me to email you the WM2D files.

[Grimer]

Can you step through your video frame by frame or not?

[Tarsier79]

Grimer, Yes, I can step through. You didn't answer my question. Where do you hope the extra energy will present itself? Can you see how conventional physics will show your design will not work?

Find the advantage, and you will have yourself a wheel.

Unfortunately, It seems the free version of WM2D has been removed, and you have to provide a reason to trial.

[Grimer]

Grimer, Yes, I can step through. You didn't answer my question. Where do you hope the extra energy will present itself? Can you see how conventional physics will show your design will not work?

Find the advantage, and you will have yourself a wheel.
...

If you can step through it you will have seen what I described.

The extra energy, the energy of the falling simple pendulum, presents itself as the steady rotation, albeit slow, of the balanced beam (compound pendulum + simple pendulum).

Conventional physics as embodied in WM2D has confirmed (thanks to you) that the design will work. If you take the trouble to dissect the programme you will find it contains all the applied maths you can eat.

Incidentally, you mentioned space. A GPM will not work in space because it needs the reaction of a large mass such as the earth together with the gravitational potential gradient associated with that mass.

[Tarsier79]

There is gravity on the moon, but no atmosphere. The moon is in space.

[daxwc]

Tarsier didn’t account yet for the loss of mass on the right hand side that you have Grimer while falling, this counter torque will make your outcome worse.

[justsomeone]

True Dax. Grimer plans on eliminating that loss with a one way clutch or a stop as in the video. This only works for the start up and once in rotation it would be useless. I guess maybe I just don't get it. ;)

[justsomeone]

Question:

If you to take the 9 o'clock weight out of the equation all together, would the 3 o'clock weight even make it past 12 o'clock? I think not. What would that say about Franks theory?

Would it even make it past 9 o'clock?

[Grimer]

... Seems the attachment problem hasn't been resolved just yet. With limited data left for the next few days, I cannot afford to keep posting vids.....

What's the problem with posting on Photobucket. I'll give you my own particulars by PM if you don't want the bother of joining yourself.

Alternatively you could send me the files of any I'm interested in and I'll put them on my own attachments file for posting on this thread. I've got plenty of room.

Two vids of particular interest to me are one with the rest removed and one where the parameters are fixed so the beam is perfectly balanced at the start of its clockwise rotation. I'll explain why I'm interested in the later after the event.