Should ISIL be stopped, right now?

[AB Hammer]

Jim W

Aggression can be effective without violence?

Is this what you mean? Or I just don't understand but it seems like what happens before the cow is launched.

http://youtu.be/A8yjNbcKkNY

[Jim Williams]

I really liked that movie.

The math student aggressively tackled his calculus assignment. There was a test coming up.

[preoccupied]

Jim Williams,

A world government sounds like a bad idea. I believe it is like a total hand out, freebie, defense limiting, or rights limiting scenario. On the hand out side, hand outs are fine in exchange for a money, but there needs to be products readily available. If there were a world government people will want the hand outs before the products are available and it would be like world communism with bad leadership. Don't take my word for it though because I don't know much about the subject.

A non-world government might work better. Like what if the US government invests a trillion dollars in equipment to build water treatment facilities. Then they mean to sell the water treatment facilities to every nation that needs them, included is toilets, but it would come at a price tag of 20 trillion dollars. Who can buy that? I say any country. All the US has to do is accept a large portion of a certain countries currency in the form of a loan and hold the currency. Then that currency would be allowed to buy the water treatment facilities. Every country that wants a good deal on the water treatment facilities would have to trade for that currency. The country whose currency that would be effected would basically get a 20 trillion dollar boost in value. That country could nation build and when the value of the currency is high enough, the US could put the currency originally borrowed as part of the deal back into the market and make a huge FOREX profit on it as a commodity. The US would permanently keep its deal for the currency and water treatment facilities but it would add other countries currencies to the deal to begin nation building for them too. Sorry I'm kind of winging it with the idea here, but as you can see, if the USA were to try nation building, the currency exchange might make it a favorable action in the form of huge profits. It could eliminate the national debt. It's only possible though with a lot of product preparation and skilled labor working hard long hours with lots of resources. Maybe a world government could arrange something similar too. I am kind of treading in new waters here. There is just something uncomfortable to me about the idea of a world government. I don't know what it is yet.

Violence can be used by the competent too and hopefully more than the incompetent do. I am not sure about Isaac Asimov. He might not have quoted that in reference to anti terrorism.

Ovyyus,

I do think we should invade and steal resources but only if they are openly threatening and only for US military support, thus a national defense issue and not to line the pockets of private citizens... Also important is that it's not permanent, we would give stuff back and train people to be competent, educated hard working people, as long as they are not openly threatening. Just, in this case, at this point in the middle east, I think any support of terrorism, such as Saudi Arabia funding ISIL? Did that happen? Or any threats anywhere in the middle east from anywhere there, is grounds to go in and disarm them for 20 years. I think it would be a safer situation for national security if that happened. And it could be done with zero casualties.

A war out of greed that has US soldier casualties, would be the gayest thing ever. If you think that is what happened for Iraq then the Iraq war would be one of the most evil things to be put on the American people. However, I am not convinced that is what happened, I just think the war was fought stupidly because there were soldier casualties involved.

[Ed]

I do think we should invade and steal resources but only if they are openly threatening... Also important is that it's not permanent, we would give stuff back...

Yeah, that wouldn't inflame anyone. "Sir, now that you are acting more reasonable... would you like the Kleenex we borrowed back? No? How about your Chapstick? No?! What about your book collection? We only read them while on the can."

[jim_mich]

Personally, I'm a libertarian. My philosophy is, don't mess with me, and I'll leave you alone. But lay one tiny finger of aggression against me, or my family, and I'll hit you with everything I got. That said, what you do in your country is your business. That is none of my business.

Though the Statue of Lady Liberty stands in NY harbor, my government it not libertarian, but I'm working on changing that.

[preoccupied]

Ed, that seems very misleading. Kleenex, Chapstick, and book collection is not a resource that would be stolen. I'm talking labor, natural resources, and currency control in the best interest of nation building. The reason nation building is important after the war is to prevent future terrorism. The fact that we left Iraq and future terrorism is brewing now is contradicting the reason we stayed there so long in the first place. So to stay on the same agenda of preventing terrorism, wouldn't we be required to more effectively invade Iraq again and any support for the incursion? If we do that, lets not spend all kinds of money and lets try to do a casualty free war.

[Ed]

You didn't get it. My comment was trying to illustrate that people don't want things back that have been grossly used.

[preoccupied]

Personally, I'm a libertarian. My philosophy is, don't mess with me, and I'll leave you alone. But lay one tiny finger of aggression against me, or my family, and I'll hit you with everything I got. That said, what you do in your country is your business. That is none of my business.

Though the Statue of Lady Liberty stands in NY harbor, my government it not libertarian, but I'm working on changing that.

That sounds so gangsta Jim_Mich, LOL. Jesus says turn the other cheek... In which I believe he means disable countries that produce terrorism but don't assault them back with punishments for it. Jesus is a smart guy.

[ovyyus]

The reason nation building is important after the war is to prevent future terrorism.

The real cause of the war can never be addressed without admitting some uncomfortable truths.

Preventing terrorism has become big business like preventing cancer. Big business always wants to get bigger.

[preoccupied]

ovyyus,
You can't seriously be suggesting that the war was to profit the Vice Presidents company? What are you suggesting?

Look, nobody wants these wars for profit only. That's sinister and false. If the wars are fought correctly, it would only serve to protect the USA, with zero US soldier casualties, and at no expense to the American tax payer or economy. The invaded countries would have a real chance to be productive and in 20 years they would own a happy productive place to live. I'm beginning to think you might be a conspiracy theorist ovyyus. =-D

[ovyyus]

Look, nobody wants these wars for profit only...

Well I could marginalize your view by saying that I'm beginning to think you might be naive. But that would be a different argument :D

[preoccupied]

ovyyus,

come on man, I'm offended at your conspiracy talk - you are going to assume Evil rather than assume incompetence? What about all of the problems in the world? Is it caused by evil and greed? I don't think so. People are simply not smart. The US military has to be one of the smartest and most important entities in the world, yet it lands boots on the ground and sends people to their deaths, due to its incompetence, not its greed or evil. I guess not everybody is Julius Caesar, just me, apparently.

[ovyyus]

How effortlessly your 'might be' slipped into a 'definitely is' :D

[terry5732]

Democracy does not work well where the people are stupid

The founders never intended for everyone to be able to vote

Zero and congress have proven that doesn't produce good results

Iran is a democracy

Stupid people voting produce bad government

Common sense has become very scarce

Education has produced low intelligence

[preoccupied]

The problem with what you say, that "democracy does not work well where the people are stupid", is that even the smart people in the world are still not good enough to get everything done i.e. US soldier casualties. Basically once a group of people are smart enough to produce goods and services that allow the people to meet their needs and wants, suddenly they're bloody geniuses. So what is intelligence in the world's eyes? Not creativity, but hard work and labor.

Iran is threatening. We should give them a poke to see if they're a bitch. Know what I'm saying? I'm saying we should hit and run in Iraq to let them know we got their threatening messages and destroy some stuff. Maybe they will declare war and then we will destroy more. If they are a bitch they will apologize and never be threatening again. Being a bitch might be in their best interest. That is if we do what we would want to do unto others.