ToyPage Note

[bluedanube]

Ok, I start this new thread not to hijack the "ToyPage discovery: Anvil is NOT aligned" as my questions are not about the hammer anvil toy, but more about the toy page in general and a little bit speculation about the note.

Many thanks Stewart for your explanation.


I am asking myself a few things:
The drawings of MT were printed one's, correct ? Bessler made handwritten notes in his personal edition, most probably intended to be added to the MT, once he gonna publish MT as book, right ?

The "top" at the toy page, is it part of the printed drawings or was it added later as the handwritings ? Someone who has seen originals could maybe answer this. I always supposed it was added hand drawn later, because it doesn't look as "perfect" drawn as the other toys and didn't got a numbering letter too.

The five could be interpreted as the count of the toys A,B,C,D,E, the top not counted because it was added later hand drawn.

Others suppose the top is counted, but figures A+B are counted as 1. I find that unlogical, why then not count C+D also as 1, as it seems to show 2 games of the same type.

Did someone noticed the black rectangle in the middle at the top of the toy page with the ink blot beside it. Was this a sixth game with letter F, Bessler decided not to show at this moment ?


Might it be, that the note "5.Kinder Spiele ..." does not translate to
Stewart translation:
"5.[Five] Children games ..."
but to
"5.[Fifth note] Children games ..."
whereas I suppose the Notes 1-4 being on the pages removed, so being the essential ones.

Great scan ovyyus !



bluedanube

[Ed]

Did someone noticed the black rectangle in the middle at the top of the toy page with the ink blot beside it?

It's possible Bessler had a hand carved up at the top of the Jacob's Ladder to show it being operated, and either it didn't ink properly or part of the hand got chipped off the woodcut, or he purposely thought it was too much detail. It almost looks like a cuff with no hand in it. Maybe he meant it to look that way.

As for the large black block at the top, this has been discussed before in other threads, but is likely just the non-carved area reserved for the number to be put at a later date.

[bluedanube]

Ed, thanks for your hint about the large black block. I forgot about it that in this times all the drawings were cut in wood.

Anyone else can answer, if the top was printed or added by hand ?

bluedanube

[Stewart]

Hi bluedanube

The top was hand-drawn in pen along with the note.

Stewart

[bluedanube]

Hi Stewart,

thanks for your confirmation. Well I think that supports my idea, that the number "5." gives not the number of toys at the page but "only" the numbering of the note.

bluedanube

[Stewart]

Well I think that supports my idea, that the number "5." gives not the number of toys at the page but "only" the numbering of the note.

I don't think we can be sure about that without seeing other pages with similarly number items. My own opinion about it is that it does mean there are five toys, but either way it doesn't make any difference to understanding the text or the image.

Stewart

[ssmyser]

Sorry to bring an old post back to the top, but I didn't want to post a new topic to much discussed subject. I was always interested in the motivation behind the hand drawn 'tippe-top' and thought I would try to post some relevant pictures here. These pictures were fairly difficult to find, and the one that most resembles Besslers drawing is in fact of Russian ancestry. Interestingly, Bessler drew the top 'in action', as the drawing shows the heavy end inverted due to angular momentum. The construction of Bessler's, top always puzzled me too: it seems (to me) to have the flywheel contained inside the body of the device. Like all the pictures here combined.

*Certainly these are toys that could have been played with "in the lane"

[ssmyser]

Couldn't figure out how to post multiple pics.

[ssmyser]

And another...

[daanopperman]

Hi ssmyser ,

If you look at the last top pic , the ring is to hold onto with one hand , while the cord is being pulled with the other .
But you might have shown another side of the top , for every time you spin the top up after it stopped , it will change direction . The cord is fixed to the top spindle , so once pulled the cord will be rewind in the opposite direction .

[Gill Simo]

I also used to imagine the top to indicate some kinda flywheel thing within...but I've since taken to the notion that what may be depicted is akin to the string in the last picture above...but wound horizontally.
I've no idea as to what, if anything, happens if one spins a top with something spinning horizontally within it...a disaster of a spinning top most likely.
But for me it's a given that this puzzle must require simple but different thinking & that anything `lateral` is more likely the case, in truth.
And the lateral in Bessler of course caused him to have a bit of a thing about placing the vertical in the horizontal.

[ssmyser]

That makes sense Daanopperman, but how does Besslers work? It clearly has the winding hole like the others, I'm wondering if the middle section spins where the drawn lines are?

I went to the online copy of MT and the equal amount of bleed-through to the back side of the page suggests that the 'top' and the writing were done at the same time. The handwriting is clearly Besslers, so the top must be as well. Bessler clearly intended to convey something with this image of the top, (as well as the Apologia wheel). These are two enigmas I just can't let go.

[Tarsier79]

I think it was Ed or Stuart who said it could be a whistling top.

I had a wooden top when I was young. As far as I remember, the string had a knot which sat in a notch, and then wound around the circumference. You then threw the top and whipped the string back for extra speed. It looked nothing like the top drawn though.

So, if the top is what Bessler alludes to, possible principles he could be pointing to: centrifugal force, or other rotational inertial products, the tippe top phenomenon, gearing vs inertial differences, burst energy input, aerodynamic effects and resonance (all I can think of at the moment).

Does that narrow your search, or widen it?

[daxwc]

While working on the toy page and going through Bill’s album this old blown up scan caught my eye. You can actually see the fingers gripping the object. The hand itself is removed maybe due to a carving mistake that made him delete it or that he was giving away too much information? Why didn’t he delete all of it? Surely if it was a wood carving mistake that you didn’t want to fix you would delete all off all the hand? Maybe he was going to fix the wood block at a later date but never got around to it. Then again maybe it is was really giveaway in his mind. Strange…

[daxwc]

The more I contemplate on it the only thing that makes sense is Bessler made a mistake (didn’t look good) and cut it out to later fix it. Which he just never got around to doing. Wood blocks like this were cut out then a new piece glued in and re-carved to fix.