Bessler's Death

[Krabat]

OK, so lets get it cleaned up:

Despite Karl the Landgrave son marrying the Swedish princess, I see no connection with Bessler’s world.

The connexion is that this is the Frederic who asked for the "inventory after death", cause he wasn't only King of Sweden but also Karl's successor as Landgraf of Hessen. Therefore, Karlshafen was part of his country. When F. W. von Malsburg confiscated the letters an apparatus Bessler left in his Karlshafen house, he did it being a servant of Frederic.
(17d Orffyreus 1 - Sicherstellung)

Adam von Mansberg was a landlord in Meinbrexen next to Fürstenberg, being an underling of the Braunschweig Karl, though at the time being in England. (JC)

So both Malsburg (Hessen) an Mansberg (Braunschweig/England) were interested in the last PM. Malsburg managed to impound the Karlshafen part of Bessler's legacy for Frederic. Mansberg wasn't able to buy the PM in Fürstenberg during Besslers lifetime. If the PM and the engravings were left in Fürstenberg, we don't know who appropriated them, probably somebody of the Mansberg family or somebody else working for the Braunschweig Karl. If Bessler in his last days brought the PM back to Karlshafen, maybe Malsburg defalcated it, or Bessler's widow hid it. Of coursealso the master himself could also have destroyed his product, if he had the time left to do so.

To me theses questions are open:

Has Karl (Braunschweig) ever shown any interest in the PM?

Is it true that the widow offered the inheritance to "the Duke" (which ist Karl, Braunschweig) as claimed in JCs book p. 160?

How could she do so, as the inheritance was impounded by the Hessians Malsburg/Frederic?

[Krabat]

Here's some help for those not aware of the political borders:

[Krabat]

The yellow surrounded country is Hessen. Karlshafen is not shown in the map because it was new built town. It has is its place in yellow surrounded Hessen, a bit south of the big letter "U" from "Herzogtum Braunschweig"

Follow the river towards north. There you will find Meinbrexen, and bit further Fürstenberg, both part of the red surrounded Herzogtum Braunschweig.

The border is the same today. Karlshafen is still in Hessen, while Fürstenberg lies in Niedersachsen.

Bessler in 1733 swore an oath, never ever to build a new PM in Hessen as a result of the troubles surrounding the arrest (which have nothing to do with the allegations of fraud). From this time on, he searched for patrons in the neighbouring countries. And this is why the last PM was built in the Herzogtum Braunschweig and not in Hessen, although only a few miles from Besslers house in Karlshafen.

[John Collins]

Thank you Krabat, for clarifying the situation. Good work!

JC

[Fletcher]

OK, so lets get it cleaned up:

Despite Karl the Landgrave son marrying the Swedish princess, I see no connection with Bessler’s world.

The connexion is that this is the Frederic who asked for the "inventory after death", cause he wasn't only King of Sweden but also Karl's successor as Landgraf of Hessen. Therefore, Karlshafen was part of his country. When F. W. von Malsburg confiscated the letters an apparatus Bessler left in his Karlshafen house, he did it being a servant of Frederic.
(17d Orffyreus 1 - Sicherstellung)

Adam von Mansberg was a landlord in Meinbrexen next to Fürstenberg, being an underling of the Braunschweig Karl, though at the time being in England. (JC)

So both Malsburg (Hessen) an Mansberg (Braunschweig/England) were interested in the last PM. Malsburg managed to impound the Karlshafen part of Bessler's legacy for Frederic. Mansberg wasn't able to buy the PM in Fürstenberg during Besslers lifetime. If the PM and the engravings were left in Fürstenberg, we don't know who appropriated them, probably somebody of the Mansberg family or somebody else working for the Braunschweig Karl. If Bessler in his last days brought the PM back to Karlshafen, maybe Malsburg defalcated it, or Bessler's widow hid it. Of course also the master himself could also have destroyed his product, if he had the time left to do so.

To me theses questions are open:

Has Karl (Braunschweig) ever shown any interest in the PM?

Is it true that the widow offered the inheritance to "the Duke" (which is Karl, Braunschweig) as claimed in JCs book p. 160?

How could she do so, as the inheritance was impounded by the Hessians Malsburg/Frederic?

Thanks also Krabat .. much appreciated.

So at this stage we only have documents for F.W. von Malsburg / Swedish King Frederic and Landgraf of Hessen appropriating the estate articles etc, and dealing with the widow and the estate, in their own words.

I assume that would be the entire estate chattels being discussed, regardless of whether she or Bessler lived in separate houses in different countries, altho close by.

So unless other documentary or factual evidence turns up it seems to show A. von Mannsberg's after death involvement with the estate did not occur.

At least the way I read your summary.

ETA : and it can't be told from those letters whether the widow offered or had little choice in the matter of confiscation of those articles. AFAIK she never got the opportunity as beneficiary of the estate to sell the model PM wheel herself.

[John Collins]

Apologies for the long delay but I came across the item I which supplied the information that Bessler fell to his death from the windmill.

It was a newspaper article from 1992. The headline in English reads 'Millions for Fairy tale and Legendary Mill'.  The article is very long so  have only quoted from the relevant text, 'Here originated a two story, half-timbered building with massive stone walls.  The roof and interior came to nothing as the builder, Orffyreus fell to his death from the walls.'

In addition to the above, Rupert Gould, whose 1944 book 'Oddities' first informed about Johann Bessler's wheel also described Bessler's fall to his death. He wrote 'Bessler died in 1745, aged sixty-five, when he fell to his death from a four and a half story windmill he was constructing in Fürstenberg'.

'Rupert T. Gould, "Orffyreus's Wheel," in Oddities: A Book of Unexplained Facts, revised ed., (London: Geoffrey Bles, 1944), pp. 89-116. Reprinted by Kessinger Pub Co., 2003, ISBN 978-0-7661-3620-5.' 

There is an image of the article describing Bessler’s death but I can’t seem to post it here. You can see it on an old blog of mine at my blog, Saturday 7th March 2020. The blog is titled ‘Random Documents’.

JC

[Sam Peppiatt]

So how did he die------------------------Sam

[agor95]

You may not have appreciated the Gravity of his situation.

[John Collins]

He fell gravely ill and died. He fell to his death Sam, but no one knows why he fell for sure.

JC

[Robinhood46]

I reckon gravity had something to do with it.

[agor95]

irony - He spend a large part of his life designing a wheel that may have used gravity.
Only to be killed by gravity.

[John Collins]

I read of his death with a heavy heart. JC

[Sam Peppiatt]

Bessler's last wheel: I've wondered, what happened to it?

It has occurred to me that it must have been his Brother, who did some thing with it, to prevent anyone from finding out how it worked--------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

Double entry, dam!

[agor95]

I would like to believe it is below the location of the base grinding wheel in the vertical windmill he was building at the time of his death.

It may have been disassembled and place there with a drawing on the underside of the stone covering it.

It would be nice but who knows.

All the Best