Covid-19

[ME]

Like I said... mutually exclusive.
No transparency, then no liberty.... No liberty, then no tools to address government issues.

Just look how the Chinese took initial responsibility.
In a free country a doctor like Li Wenliang would not be suppressed when blowing some whistle.
Until China was basically forced to become a little bit transparent when it became a little bit too visible and there was no other way out.... and... wait for it.... ah, now it's closed again.

In a dictatorship the government sometimes has no transparency but take all the responsibility

Are you sure about that?
Dictators are know to dictate whatever comes up in their heads but are not very well known for taking responsibility for it nor allowed to be investigated when under suspicion of shady things.
They're the first to suppress news, or buy them up or force them to sprout whatever they dictate.
They are the first to yell "fake news" whenever they dislike the echo.

More ontopic: They are the first countries to manipulate the Covid statistics, or stop providing them all together with the worst excuse being that people are harmed by those statistics.

This is one article: Mapping violations of free speech under the cloak of the coronavirus crisis
https://www.eurozine.com/disease-control/

[Oystein]

I have a couple of issues about this topic.

What is the worst..missinformation or supression?
Trump versus China?

The result is the same.

Trump and kushner just said that US will have only 60.000 dead, and that this corona virus handling was a great success story.. Well the number will be the double at least.. is that miss information? It"s impossible that they don"t know. So isn"t that the same as dictatorship in action?

And California refuse to test all their dead for Covid-19, but want to open because of their low numbers..

Is this supression or miss information? They know all is lies, but for the best of the econony. People are being fooled. Does it really matter if it is supression or miss information??

And how on earth is it possible to blame China for own faults? If China, with a new and unknown virus outbreak easily could have stopped it, why couldn"t US stop it?? They had knowledge and time, and even the DNS sequence of the virus before enybody was reported dying. And even refused to receive Covid-19 tests from WHO to test the travellers coming home from China.

And why do they say their testing is best in the world when it's not at all? Well, we know why (votes) but why do people applaud bullshit every day?

My guess is at least 120.000 dead in the US.. could I be smarter than Trump?? lol And what will Trump say..will he excuse himself to the people when they surpass 100.000 ? Isimply don't get all the lies..I simply hate lies.

Best
ØR

[daxwc]

Here is the dossier claim again in another paper.
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/11532002/ ... ssier-spy/

Oystein, you are too focused on what Trump is doing, turn off your state propaganda machine. UK, Australia, Canada, Italy and the USA all have investigations on going on China’s actions; do you really think they are doing that for Trump?

Also the calls grow louder for an international investigation.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/china-aus ... -1.5548868

[ovyyus]

It lays out both sides fairly evenly on what they know or don’t know. Unless of course if you don’t trust Australia’s intelligence community.

You seem to confuse trust in Australia's intelligence community with trust in News Corp's Saturday Telegraph newspaper. Right biased newspaper interpretations of unpublished dossiers shouldn't inspire trust.


Theories of SARS-CoV-2 origins:

It is improbable that SARS-CoV-2 emerged through laboratory manipulation of a related SARS-CoV-like coronavirus. As noted above, the RBD of SARS-CoV-2 is optimized for binding to human ACE2 with an efficient solution different from those previously predicted7,11. Furthermore, if genetic manipulation had been performed, one of the several reverse-genetic systems available for betacoronaviruses would probably have been used19. However, the genetic data irrefutably show that SARS-CoV-2 is not derived from any previously used virus backbone20. Instead, we propose two scenarios that can plausibly explain the origin of SARS-CoV-2: (i) natural selection in an animal host before zoonotic transfer; and (ii) natural selection in humans following zoonotic transfer. We also discuss whether selection during passage could have given rise to SARS-CoV-2.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9

[daxwc]

Right biased newspaper interpretations of unpublished dossiers shouldn't inspire trust.

Oh! I am starting to see how this works only left biased newspapers are allowed to leak intelligence dossiers and be taken seriously. How silly of me. I guess the person that leaked it didn’t know all your rules either. 8P

[daxwc]

You know very well Ovyyus the investigations are focusing on an accidental leak of the virus from the lab, not contesting the genetic make up or origins. They are even more focused on China's actions it took. With good reason the nearest bats with anything close to that virus was 1000 km away, the lab though is in that city.

[ovyyus]

Oh! I am starting to see how this works only left biased newspapers are allowed to leak intelligence dossiers and be taken seriously. How silly of me. I guess the person that leaked it didn’t know all your rules either. 8P

Sorry, didn't mean to trigger you. I should have said:

Biased newspaper interpretations of unpublished dossiers shouldn't inspire trust.


At least you agree that News Corp runs right biased publications.

[daxwc]

ME:

daxwc wrote:
In a dictatorship the government sometimes has no transparency but take all the responsibility

Are you sure about that?

No. I meant the dictator takes all the responsibility when looked upon by another country not its own people. Who can they blame as the leader of the country. They can’t say that’s what the majority of voters wanted or other fallbacks.

[ovyyus]

You know very well Ovyyus the investigations are focusing on an accidental leak of the virus from the lab, not contesting the genetic make up or origins.

How can I 'know' about an unpublished dossier?

You're not contesting now?

So why didn’t China let WHO track down the virus’s start. Just coincidence it started 5 miles away from China’s only level 4 germ warfare plant.

The western world has also known for years China might be involved in biological warfare which would be done in that lab as it is the only level 4 lab known in China. All there is left is the blame game.

[daxwc]

ovyyus:

At least you agree that News Corp runs right biased publications.

I read/glance through around 10 newspapers or everyday rarely do I care which way they lean or how far, only that the facts are true and they report both sides of the story. Saying that Huffpost, Breightbart and NYT gave me heartburn. I didn’t even know where most sat till you came out with your biased mediabiasfactcheck. I still don’t really know cause the website sucks.

Wiki: The Columbia Journalism Review describes Media Bias/Fact Check as an amateur attempt at categorizing media bias and Van Zandt as an "armchair media analyst." The Poynter Institute notes, "Media Bias/Fact Check is a widely cited source for news stories and even studies about misinformation, despite the fact that its method is in no way scientific.

At least I will not end up like Rose:
“I used to be a proud democrat� stated Rose McGowan on Twitter. “I was always told it was the Democratic Party that were the good guys, that our papers were The New York Times and The Washington Post. But now I know too much. And I feel really quite a sense of loss tonight.� https://www.rt.com/op-ed/487364-rose-mc ... eet-metoo/



I am more worried about social platforms censoring people no matter what their political views. What is this China? Then the left mainstream media ignores it so if you only read one view you would be oblivious to the problem.
https://www.rt.com/usa/487641-candace-o ... -lockdown/

[daxwc]

You're not contesting now?

Contesting what? That if China was going to be doing any biological warfare it would be in that lab? I have read enough to believe the virus was not manipulated there now. It is still unknown it the virus was accidently leaked from there.

You never know, the facts could change yet and I will believe something else next week. Its why they need the international investigation.

[ovyyus]

You never know, the facts could change yet and I will believe something else next week. Its why they need the international investigation.

We can rely on the facts changing, so why believe anything? I agree that an international investigation is needed to help understand the origin of the virus, and then extended to help understand the handling of the pandemic by all governments.

[Oystein]

And more importantly how to avoid the uprise of similar or worse virus pandemics in the future.

We could even see pets forbidden.

Or virus research done on islands with 30 days quarantine..

And agree on who is to be listened to, and who make false claims. And who causes most uneccesary deaths... missinformation or cencorship..

And how to prepare a country.

Much to be learned from investigating this primary root, but also the secondary and tertial handling should be investigated.

Best
ØR

[Robinhood46]

My guess is that the best thing to do to avoid/reduce similar or worse virus pandemics in the future, would be to stop thinking we can change the environment that we were designed to live in without it have an effect on how our body can cope with normal run of the mill viruses.

[agor95]

... would be to stop thinking we can change the environment that we were designed to live in

how our body can cope with normal run of the mill viruses.

:-)

You are quite correct we should stop changing or environment.

Continue to go into deep dark caves knees high in bat shit and get splattered
in bat faeces and blood. We should learn to cope with normal run of the mill viruses.

We could all enjoy septic tank swimming, back stroke anyone, to be at one with the environment.

Then we can pop down to the local city market for some breakfast.

Blood pudding sandwich - humm

However - you do have a good point that we should accept a degree of infected related deaths. But not if we roll round in muck - not washing and eating bacteria/virus infected food.

All the Best - The Olympic Game - Guest Sport - maggot tank swimming