I almost forgot about this one idea

[preoccupied]

Does anybody remember about the guy who pumped water using a pendulum? He would tap on the pendulum with his finger and pump a lot of water. He had a seesaw where the swing of the pendulum dipped down and was pulled back up when it was off to the side in the swing by a spring. I forget what it was called and who invented it. Does anybody remember what I'm talking about?

[Wubbly]

Go to youtube and search for "veljko milkovic pendulum"

I did a WM2D sim on it here: https://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/view ... 585#172585

Everyone who looked into it has determined there is no extra energy in the system.

[preoccupied]

Thank you Wubbly. That is who I was referring to. Well I don't know how you determined that there was no extra energy in it. Something that I think is true is that how much it oscillates determines how much the pendulum slows down and therefore how much energy is needed to reset the pendulum to maximum swing. A variable that I think should be measured is whether a longer lever swinging would slow down any slower or faster given a certain amount of oscillation allowed. I think that a longer lever and a more proper energy loop back to the lever would be the best test of whether this would work. I think that this can restart itself in one direction and provide an out put of free energy in the other direction or oscillation. Also a smaller oscillation might slow down the slowing down of the pendulum but there seems to be very minimal need to provide energy to restart the pendulum so a very small amount of energy could spout out through a gear ratio and provide greater distance using the gears. I imagine it pushing the pendulum high up and almost over the top except that it hits a peg to stop its over the top rotation.

[agor95]

Hi

Just looked a the links and found this https://www.pendulum-lever.com/pendulum-pump.html.

One can see the energy to lift the water will have to come from somewhere.

Also lifting water is a little of a brute force method.

Saying that one can ask questions like how much energy is supplied to sustain the pendulum weight swing and how does that change as the weight/spring increase in value?

Working on the premise the distance in the pump action is non-variable.
Also the friction of the pivot and are are constant when the swing happens.

The other item is latching. As any action that stores energy should be held until that energy can be used at the correct time.

Has any members tested a pendulum by looking at the force at the bottom as the pendulum swing?
Then the force required to lift the pendulum weights at the top of the swing.

We know the P.E. converts to K.E. with the maximum is at the bottom of the swing.

However the C.F. effect is zero were a solid pivot is used.

In this case the C.F. is transferred with a loss in pendulum height.

This question; Could the latched stored energy in the pump spring be used to lift the pendulum weights at the end of it's swing?

What is the energy differences between C.F. stored and weight lift to recover the distance?

Regards all

[agor95]

Hi

We have a good wiki site; were we have a 'Nech Library.

https://www.besslerwheel.com/wiki/index ... echLibrary

This is a great place to hold the persistent analysis.
This is not the nature on a forum which is more a 'of the moment' format.

It would help accessability if all 'Respected' rated and above have edit rights by default then we can accumulate analysis.

All have viewing rights.

You can see access is one of the block to updating the wiki.

Regards

[eccentrically1]

https://www.pendulum-lever.com/pendulum-pump.html.
"File not found"

It's at least easy to see the lack of perpetual motion in the 2SO.

[preoccupied]

I want to generate electricity with this pendulum power idea. I would secretly use the pendulum to generate electricity as a power company. First my hometown then the world. I wouldn't stop until I generated all electricity worldwide and I would never admit to using a perpetual motion machine. I would be able to price my electricity near what my competitors price their electricity and I would always have the cheaper electricity but as expensive as possible electricity to earn profit. I think that this pendulum power would be able to reset itself using gears. Every swing a little extra energy would be applied to the pendulum from a gear.

[Tarsier79]

Build it, prove it. Simple.

[preoccupied]

I think that the two stage mechanical oscillation has shown excess over unity. The work of pumping water with only the input of a tap of a finger is impossible without the over unity here. The pendulum can be pushed on by a gear. Why wouldn't that work? Here is a rough sketch in MS Paint of how it could be rigged up. Why wouldn't that work?

[preoccupied]

A heavy flywheel could push on the pendulum to reset it. I think that the water pump proves that this is over unity. So the pendulum could be shorter than the wheel so if it's set a little bit down it can hit a peg and the peg will naturally move out of the way but the wheel will reset the pendulum and there could be multiple weights falling. The banging heard in Besslers wheel could be this just the peg hitting the pendulum. Why wouldn't this work? The force of the swinging weight is incredible. This is just the kind of simple thing that Bessle could have been paranoid enough to hide.

[preoccupied]

Milkovics two stage mechanical oscillator takes up too much horizontal space to fit into a wheel. I suggest using a pulley counter weight for the second oscillation instead. The next complication would be timing the wheel hitting the pendulum or some ratchet system if possible. The actual build can't be done by me. I haven't a machine shop or wood working. And I imagined building it and I used Pepsi bottles for weights in my imagination.

[preoccupied]

If the heavy flywheel pushes on the pendulum faster than gravity is pulling down on it, then the force of the flywheel will contribute to the force pulling down. Thus I think that it's similar to the clue the weights gain force from their own swinging. I think this is Bessler's Wheel. As simple as that. I haven't heard a good example for why the two stage mechanical oscillator is not over unity. It produces 12x the force put in. It's just not arranged very usefully as it is classically built. I think my crappy drawings here could be how it could really run perpetually.

[preoccupied]

I don't think that the pendulum oscillating in the center of the wheel drawing would work. I think that the up and down motion would close the gate of the pendulums swing. I think that Milkovic two stage oscillator the way he designed it would work if the axle of the pendulum pulls a pulley. And then the pulley pushes a spring or directly on the pendulum to reset it.

How is rlortie doing? I know he is very old. Did he die? Jim_Mich died. I didn't hear about rlortie. I suffer from a variety of negative cognitive symptoms and sometimes I am bright and sometimes not so much. I was suffering from headaches and memory loss. I have been hit on the head many many times. I had shared a water displacement mechanism with rlortie a long time ago instead of posting it on the forum. I did it because the math worked out finally for what I was looking at. I also talked about time travel with rlortie and I wonder if rlortie is time traveling now. I remember time traveling when I was a teenager and I think that I had greater mental clarity when I was messaging rlortie then so I might have properly informed him how to time travel. I don't remember how to time travel. I also don't remember what the water displacement mechanism was. It's just a side effect of my condition. I am very unlucky.

[preoccupied]

I don't know anything about grandfather clocks. I think that knowledge would help a lot with this. But I imagine a spring inside of a gear like my picture that I drew in ms paint. I don't know how to draw the timing mechanism but it would have to release the gear to turn the pendulum higher on one side for each gear with a spring inside of it. I almost want to make the gear faster in case it's not fast enough to move the pendulum. Some kind of high gear ratio could be used to make the spring faster.

[preoccupied]

Instead of the axle of the pendulum pulling on a pulley. I think better is the gear turning against a railing or a curved bar.

The green gear spring is wound when the axle of the pendulum falls. I don't know why this was so hard to come up with. It seems logical.

Now the only thing that needs to be invented is an escapement. I don't know very much about escapements for clocks but it's like that. The gears spring should apply force to the pendulum in only one direction. So it applies force in one direction and then stops so it has to be locked in place until the next opportunity to apply pressure. Still thinking on that. Any help? I just want some clockwork.