A new magnet motor...

[Neo]

Take a look at this...looks legite.


http://cycclone.com/welcome/page1.php

[Techstuf]

Is that a magnetic wanker engine?

[rlortie]

Neo,

This link has been posted here before, I quote you the following as I did then.

Now that Cycclone is able to operate by itself, focus has turned to obtaining direct investment and to complete the development program laid out during the course of last year, that is, to finalise the purpose built engine and fit the engine to the company's test vehicle.

To complete the development program tells me that the motor doe not work and that the so called parent company has pulled the plug. Its a scam if I ever seen one.

Ralph

[Oxygon]

if you noticed the setup in the video of the batteries and alternator...

if its just a looped motor/motor setup I can't see it as anything other than theoretical design hype...

[Shane]

if you noticed the setup in the video of the batteries and alternator...

if its just a looped motor/motor setup I can't see it as anything other than theoretical design hype...

I got the impresion, from watching the video, that the batteries were just to run the starter motor. It is kind of hard to be certain what the batteries are actually used for in the video. Maybe it was just the wishful dreamer coming out in me. I guess we will just have to wait until the company truly proves their claim. - Shane

[rlortie]

Magnetic or not, if its got wires then it has resistance, if it has resistance then old man Lenz is going to step in and leave the door open and there goes all your energy.

It is all hype and the wording in the above link is careful not to let themselves get caught in a civil fraud suit.

It is quite apparent that investors are not beating down there door as this same link was brought to attention months ago.

I said it then and I will try again, Would you like to invest in vacuum packed post holes?

Ralph

[Michael]

It says right in the video, it's not free energy but at least it's green. Okay, so it's not free energy and it uses batteries...what is it then?
Scam.

[ken_behrendt]

Well, I updated my Media Player 7.0 to the 10.0 as recommended, but I still could not view the video clips at their site. I just kept getting the Page Not Found message...

Ralph wrote:

To complete the development program tells me that the motor doe not work and that the so called parent company has pulled the plug.

Actually, they do say that the motor runs by itself and then add that they need further investment:

to finalise the purpose built engine and fit the engine to the company's test vehicle.

So, apparently, they want the investor to believe that the motor works, but they only need more investment to, perhaps, upscale the design and make it powerful enough to run an automobile.


I've seen this kind of marketing on previous magnetic motors. One that immediately comes to mind was a motor (I can't recall the name right now) that was the subject of a popular technology magazine article during the late '80's. The inventor's patent was refused and he went to federal court and, eventually, was granted a patent. His invention sounded too good to be true and, in the years that followed, nothing ever came of it. I suspect that the same fate will befall the Cycclone motor.

Just because a device is connected to a battery does not necessarily mean that it would not be OU/PM in operation. It might require an initial input of electrical energy to get things going after which it would produce enough energy to replace that taken from the battery and do useful external work.


ken

[Paul]

With regard to these new devices I have two theories:
1) they are frauds, the engines do not work at all.
2) the engines work and, being an uncomfortable matter for many, the big companies or the governments try to silt up the inventions.
I am more oriented towards the first theory :)
Paul

[jim_mich]

One that immediately comes to mind was a motor (I can't recall the name right now) that was the subject of a popular technology magazine article during the late '80's.

Ken, that magazine was "Science & Mechanices". The inventor was Howard Johnson. At the time he lived in Grass Lake, Michigan about 25 miles from me. He has since moved to West Virgina. The last I heard he was working with a magnet company still trying to make his magnet motor work well enough to be of commercial value.
It is my opinion that Mr. Johnson has a marginally workable motor and that he does not understand the real principle as to why it works. Without understanding the principle, he is unable to improve it beyond something that barely runs.

[Shane]

He has since moved to West Virgina. The last I heard he was working with a magnet company still trying to make his magnet motor work well enough to be of commercial value.

I did a lot of reading and experiments, in the 90's, to try and duplicate this motor. The field orientation of the magnets is very unusual, and hard to find. Howard Johnson also claimed that to get a functioning device he had to carefully hand select the magnets, even if they were from the same batch. The rumor of why he had to go to court to get his patent issued was that he did not produce a rotary motor for the patent examiners. He instead presented three different linear motors to prove the concept. If Memory serves me right, the address from his latest patent was Roanoke? West Virginia. I even read somewere that, that address was the address of a military installation there. - Shane

[jim_mich]

Mr. Johnson has two linear magnet motor patents also. Patent numbers are 4,877,983 and 5,402,021 while his original patent 4,151,431 was both linear and rotary.

The 'C' shape of his magnets is not very special. It is much like a horseshoe magnet except spread apart and pointed on the ends. This concentrates the magnetic flux into a very small point. The secret is in the supporting plate behind the other magnets. This redirects the magnetic flux back up through the space between those magnets. This magnetic flux fluctuates depending on the location of the 'C' shaped magnets. It is this pulsing fluctuation that drives his motor. When the 'C' shape magnetic field is the same direction as the other magnet then the flux entering the supporting plate is strong. When the two magnets are opposite polarity then the flux entering the supporting plate is weak. The supporting plate redirects the flux up through the space gap. The strength alternates strong and weak. There is some hysteresis or time delay for the change in magnetic strength in the supporting plate. This moves the 'C' shaped magnet along.

It would probably work better if the supporting plate was individual plates. Also the supporting plate material is critical. Mr. Johnson seems to have concentrated on everything except the specs for the supporting plate.

[ken_behrendt]

I do not really know what to make of Howard Johnson's motor. I have known at least one person who tried to replicate it and could not.

Johnson sounds like a man who has handled a lot of magnets and would understand their subtle properties well. However, I have yet to read of anybody getting one of this motors to run continuously. I think there was one post on an energy forum that claimed a model had be kept running for 20 minutes, but one does not know how much credence to place in that figure.

Below I have attached some diagrams from one of his patents along with my best guess as to how it is supposed to work. Johnson has his own vocabulary when describing the behavior of the magnets in his design. I've given my own interpretation of what is supposed to happen. I think that the design is supposed to momentarily "short circuit" magnetic forces so that one of a pair of magnets is always experiencing magnetic repulsion at any time. This sounds like a sophisticated way to shield magnetic fields that is, perhaps, novel.

In any event, I will be watching and waiting to see if anything ever comes of this device...


ken

[rlortie]

As I have stated before, I have hard copies of Howard Johnson's motor. this not only includes his original patent but also a report on his three year battle with the patent appeals board. leading to him receiving patent 4,151,431 April 24, 1979.

Included in this collection is a copy of the original Science and Mechanics article and artists rendition of a motor that to my knowledge, to this day has not been built.

I also have a copy of his 32 page Unitar Conference papers detailing all the mathematical equations, charts and history. This paper was presented at the Unitar Conference on long-term Energy Resources, Montreal Canada, November 26-December7, 1979.

The bottom line is, the patent was based on an appeals board who saw a plastic toy car propel itself across a series on magnets not unlike what today we call a smot.

It is my understanding that the only way a circular rotor has ever been turned is by hand pumping the stator magnets. One can relate this to another forum called Minatowheel

Minato Wheel information web site at: http://www.fdp.nu
A copy of the File Section is at: http://www.fdp.nu/shared

Messages archives at :
http://www.egroups.com/group/minatowheel/ The email address of the group is: minatowheel@yahoogroups.com

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/minatowheel/


I would be willing to answer any questions regarding this post.

Ralph

[Wheeler]

Ralph
I do want to say that you are well studied in this felid.
From my simple study of the HoJo design, it never worked and can not.
I think the Cycclone is just a helper not self powered.
The web site is to try and get money as far as I can see.
They may hope upper class web searchers will want to be in on energy systems and not look into things and just simply call and invest.
Bingo they get lots of money, and have lots more fun with it.