Zeroing in on Bessler's wheel

[WaltzCee]

and frictionless.

& I'm prepared to deliver right now. It sounded like you resolved point a) by expecting a delivery of this 21 century braking system.

Is that the case?

[Sam Peppiatt]

Walt,
I'm not quite ready for it, but at least, I'll have when I get the super wheel up and running, ( why do I have a feeling that this going to be good)------------------------------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

Nothing is working. I think you guys are right, it can't be done-------------------------Sam

[WaltzCee]

No one is saying it can't be done. There are a lot of ways to do the same thing. Consider just the idea of making a PM wheel. Your mind immediately runs to

• How we gonna stop it?

Stopping PM wheels has never been much of a problem. Worse case scenario, run away wheel, we appoint a government commission to study the wheel.

That wheel is going to regret the moment it began to work.

By the way Sam, by any chance do you work for some government?

[Sam Peppiatt]

Hi Waltcy!!

Yea, I was getting a way ahead of myself. No, I'm retired, too old to work---------------------Sam

[WaltzCee]

In truth no one really works for the goobermint, shammy my boy.

They're sort of a fictitious force gumming up the cogs of industry, usually led by the titians of industry for the sole purpose of making things more expensive for consumers and their competition.

Usually before they destroy things to build back better they shuffle their capital in the appropriate areas.

Your approach of solving nonexistent problems brought to mind goobermint.

[WaltzCee]

You guys have me stumped!
3.Brakes, no problem. A wood block rubbing on a wood axel, just pore a bucket of water on it,
or just change the mechanical function, but how did that work in1700?

I guess I must lack the superior intellect that you all have-------------------------------------------------------------Sam

The attached load of the stampers could be seen as a pulsed load on the wheel.

The mass of the stampers could be replaced by hydraulic springs.

[MrTim]

• How we gonna stop it?

Stopping PM wheels has never been much of a problem. Worse case scenario, run away wheel, we appoint a government commission to study the wheel.

That wheel is going to regret the moment it began to work.

The gov't will find a way to tax it to death. (Which is why I'm a proponent of wheel builders/users hiding their wheels like Prohibition bootleggers hid their stills... ;-)

[Sam Peppiatt]

Right now, the problem of stopping the wheel is pretty much of a joke. But with the wheel running, it would have to be resolved in some way. Bessler did find a way to flip the weights / arms over, to change the direction of rotation. If you could control the arms, and swing them straight down, it would put the wheel in neutral. I.E., the wheel would be statically balanced-------------------------------------Sam

[johannesbender]

That wheel is going to regret the moment it began to work.
The gov't will find a way to tax it to death. (Which is why I'm a proponent of wheel builders/users hiding their wheels like Prohibition bootleggers hid their stills... ;-)

On top of that you have clever thieves , who will pop up with your design in a different form , acting like they invented it , there are disgusting people out there , glory stealing , money greedy , pile's of shit , they want "more for less" .

[Sam Peppiatt]

Progress maybe^
The weights simply have to shift in on the up side and out on the down side. So easy to say, yet so difficult to achieve. Some basics: The wheel can't be OOB all the time; neither can it be balanced all the time. But, it does have to switch back and forth from one state to the other and, do it very quickly.
This is where a translating weight with a directional bearing is so effective. The bearing, or one way clutch, instantly shifts from OOB to balanced. However, shifting from balance, back to OOB, is much more difficult. It requires flipping the weights / pendulums, up and in on the up side and again, up and out on the down side. Unfortunately, that's been a big stumbling block.

Continued; have to take a break. This key board is a big nightmare for me---------------------------------------------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

The question is then, how to flip them up?
My brother has given me a good Idea on how to do that, a brilliant idea actually! There are two pendulums on one pivot pin. One bigger and heavier than the other, which hangs more or less straight down and is free swinging. The other, smaller and lighter, is held more or less horizontally, (by the bigger one), and has the locking bearing. It becomes more of a weighted arm, rather than a pend., borrowing from John Collins terminology.

They work in pairs one lifting, the other flipping. A spring between the two of then provides the lifting force. The smaller one pushes off from the bigger one so to speak. The great thing about it, is; since they are both translating / isolated from the wheel, the spring doesn't cause any back torque. However, the spring can only do about 90% of the lifting; it can't do all of it.

It's almost there, but not quite-----------------------------------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

FWEIW
Finding a good way to flip the weighted arm, (pend.), up has been a major break through. The spring provides about 90% of the lifting force required. However, the spring can't do all of the lifting, because, it doesn't know when to do it, when to flip it. A second element is needed.

The big pendulum, drives a gear, with a tooth that extends out from it. As it rotates, it engages the arm, flipping it up, controlling the timing of it. Since the arm(s) flip twice per revolution of the wheel, up and out on the down side, and in and up on the up side, it, the tooth gear, has to turn twice as fast. I.E., twice as fast as the big pendulum. Maybe^, the Koo Koo clock will work yet----------------------------------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

FWEIW,
Trying to explain how a gravity ONLY wheel might work has proven to be, nearly as difficult as trying to build one. Basically you need two heavy arms, more or less horizontal, one at 3:00 pointing in and, the other at 9:00 pointing out, for CCW rotation. The arm going down at 9:00 locks to the wheel, throwing it OOB. The arm at 3:00 going up, also locks to the wheel and, it too throws the wheel OOB.

At the top and bottom of the wheel, both arms unlock, (go back to being balanced), reset / flip up, relock to the wheel and, the cycle repeats, again and again. Anyway that's the Idea of it. Looks like the resetting can be done with a jack shaft, parallel with the shaft that the arms swing on. Similar to the cam shaft on a gasoline engine, that controls the timing of the valves. It, the reset shaft, controls the locking and unlocking of the arms but, has to turn twice the speed of the wheel because, each arm has to reset twice per revolution, of the wheel----------------------Sam

[Sam Peppiatt]

Update,
Looks like the reset shaft will work. It turns twice the speed of the wheel and drives one fourth section, or 90 degrees of a gear, which engages a gear on the heavy arms, for 90 degrees, than releases for 90. The reset occurs and, also lasts for 90 degrees, at both the top and bottom of the wheel. The clutch does all of the locking and unlocking. The arm on the down side drives the wheel for 90 degrees as does the arm on the up side, for CCW rotation. However, mechanically it's getting to be a bitch to build---------------------------------------Sam

PS I think I need a clock maker----------------