A new magnet motor...

[Techstuf]

Interesting hypothesis Alden!


Oops, I meant Ralph.



TS

[rlortie]

ovyyus,

Ken, I don't think anyone has achieved a totally free permanent magnet suspension that is stable. The 'Levitron' toy was a bit of a breakthrough in this regard but it isn't passive of course - gyroscopic action maintains it's stability

To my knowledge you are absolutely correct. Thus we have a challenge that I feel could be solved much quicker than Bessler's wheel. I have had much less problems with a full vertical suspension than horizontal. The levitron toy is not unlike the displays on my desk. One is made up of three octagon cubes with rounded ends that rotate while revolving on a mirrored platform.

I have the resources and technology to attempt this, if I just could get a kick in the you know what to get me moving on it. My vertical approach is down to a needle point for horizontal control while a passive perpendicular position is completely free and yet controllable.

With a vertical axis at higher rpm gyroscopic action becomes a hinderance instead of being helpful. A gyroscope want to tip with the alignment of the earths rotation ( just like the levitron) in relation to your geographic location. This effect plays hell with a stationary magnetic vertical guide bearing system. To negate this problem one has to gimbal mount the wheel until angle is found and then lock the gimbal.

For a mechanical transference I believe that a horizontal axis type would be considerably more beneficial than a vertical concept. I have not tried it yet, but would hope that a vertical positioned wheel would not be effected by gyroscopic properties other than the welcome inertia and centrifugal forces.

Ralph

[rlortie]

turulato,

Well if you knew that guy Tom and he was full of hot air back then, after all these years you would thing he would have run out of air, but I guess he must be a relative of the ever-ready bunny.

Yes it is possible that he is related to the Ever-Ready bunny.

Unfortunately the batteries were installed backwards and he just keeps coming and coming. :-)

To set the record straight I did not actually know him in 1957 as he was in a different class schedule learning the same subjects. But I knew of him and his outgoing personality.

This was in the days of transition from vacuum tube theory to solid state. And I believe it was that theory change from electrons moving to the holes between the electrons that he got the idea of zero point energy.

Ralph

[ken_behrendt]

Ralph...

Here's a design that my friend and I were considering just before we gave up on the project. It uses magnetic repulsion to "trap" the ends of a rotor's axle between 5 magnets located at each end of the axle. It requires a total of 12 cylindrical Alnico magnets.


ken

[rlortie]

Ken,

Your above sketch is pretty close to my thinking with one exception. if your were to run your design through a magnetic simm. the four outer supporting magnet will form a continuous loop and then alter the field between the endo magnets.

As the patent drawing shows, there are no vertical placed support magnets. Only two creating a saddle, are required to support the axle. I would think that the use of four is detrimental as they would cause conflicting flux patterns on axis magnet.

Your axle length should extend out a little further to the end magnets getting them out of the support flux path. One of the stationary end magnets is adjustable.

Ralph

[Jonathan]

I disagee, I say it will stick to 4:30 or 7:30 oc.
It is of course impossible to make a purely magnetic levitation, since something can only be said to levitate if it is resisting gravity, and gravity is not known to be magnetic. Since gravity is already part of the concept, why not make it helpful? This model would be able to spin about the vertical axis, but not too fast.
PS. That's not a joint below, it's a weight.

[Michael]

I think the simplest way to do it is like this. Make a hollow shell sphere with one pole inside the sphere and one pole on the outside. Create a larger concave half sphere with the same polarity inside it as the polarity on the outside of the full sphere and sit the full sphere inside the concave sphere. It should float inside of it.

[Techstuf]

Possibly....but are you apprised of what is required to create and maintain such a field as you propose?


TS

[Michael]

Hi Mitch,

Well there is a fairly simple way. Just get some small powerful magnets. Cut them into equalateral triangles. Form them into a sphere like what is done when Geodomes are made. The smaller and tighter the triangles the better. Do the same with the half sphere.

Richard Buckminster Fuller


http://www.pitsco.com/Neatstuff/geodome.htm

[rlortie]

Jonathan,

Sorry, but it does not stick at 4:30 and 7:30.. It does not stick anywhere in 360 degrees of rotation.

I have attached a picture (or will attempt to) with this post. the axle is suspended in the carved tree trunk branch which contains two magnets, one on each side. the axle hub contains one magnet.

The thread that holds it in place can be seen at the back of axle. It is in motion when this picture was taken. To show relevant size it is setting on the 8x11 copy of figure #4 that ken posted.

I believe that two of these attached end to end and install two vertical supports at ends to hold adjustable thrust magnets would eliminate the thread and result in a full blown suspend axle and wheel. We then have our Orffyun Bearing to present to Alden.

Ralph

[rlortie]

No you did not get a picture, now matter how hard I try I keep being told that it is to many bytes. I have clipped it as much as I dare and still no luck.

I need help in learning how to drop the resolution without loosing to much definition.

Ralph

[rlortie]

Michael,
your geo dome concept sounds like it would work.

But the proof that I have just pickup off the rug after taking four pictures and set back on my desk next to my computer screen says it is not required.

Jonathans statement about sticking is not hard to conceive but it does not do so as long as the magnet in the axis is centered with the two that is place below and to each side. There is a very reasonable tolerance allowed in this centering. If one attempts to pull it to far it simple stick to the support in an off lateral position. A small pull will put it back into operation.

I will mail you the picture and maybe you can figure out how to post it for me.

Ralph

[SeaWasp]

Ralph. The maximum upload filesize allowed is 256Kb. If you have a program like paintshop or photoshop, you can increase the compression of a .jpg file to bring the pictures filesize down.

Spiros.

[Techstuf]

Michael,
your geo dome concept sounds like it would work

4 words.....


Path of least resistance.



TS

[jim_mich]

I need help in learning how to drop the resolution without loosing to much definition.

How to reduce a picture file size...

Open your large .jpeg picture using Windows Paint.
Do a 'Save As' with a new name else you will overwite the original file.
Many times it will be smaller (I won't go into the details of why). If not then do the following...

Click Stretch/Skew and stretch it both Horizontal and Vertical to say 66 percent.
Do a 'Save As' with a new name else you will overwite the original file.

Pictures must be 256 kb or smaller to upload.