Part Three is the Charm

[Sam Peppiatt]

Fletcher,
I don't see how the two weights can be close together, going up from 6:00 to about 8;00 or so---------------------Sam

[Fletcher]

I imagine you have done one or two sims of MT24 in the past Fletcher.

Decades ago Kaine - as far as I can see MT24 is just an 8 sector version of the 4 sector MT25 fwiw .. perhaps it just suggests more mechs for more power ? ..

Fletcher,
I don't see how the two weights can be close together, going up from 6:00 to about 8;00 or so---------------------Sam

Sam .. imagine this .. if the red hinge (n.b. rods are massless in wm2d) has next to no mass then there is little to no resistance to the yellow lws falling towards 6 o'cl etc ..

As the red hinge mass is increased this causes a resistance to the yellow lws falling back towards 6 o'cl etc .. you can see what mass values they have in the red slider INPUT to the left side of the sim ..

IMO the technical physics answer is that under gravity acceleration two connected bodies can only move when one body loses more GPE than the other loses or gains .. iow's leverage .. there has to be an active gradient of potential that the bodies NET COM can traverse and lose Potential Energy to have ANY flow of mass movement ..

[Fletcher]

Sam .. here is the comparison of different hinge masses LHS & RHS wheels .. motor turned on ..

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[UbWe]

Sam .. here is the comparison of different hinge masses LHS & RHS wheels .. motor turned on ..

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Aren't you glad you support Alan. Are you aware that when you hate someone then that makes loving Jubat desirable? And
then he'll like you for supporting him. Your post saying I'm the problem in the forum only encouraged him.

[Sam Peppiatt]

That looks a lot better, Fletcher. I think the the one one the right is the way it should be. The hinge mass is held up by the string. Sorry if I'm being picky--Sam (Or maybe I don't know what I'm talking about)

[Fletcher]

Here it is again Sam .. this time I added a "separator" between the yellow lw 1 kg and its red hinge 1 kg - in this case the distance between them does not change but I deactivated the separator anyway and tracked it .. if you watch the mid point of the grey separator (mid point on rod also) it would be where the COM would be for the combined 2 kgs - that mid-point COM swings like a pendulum until it can find a way to lose GPE, which you can see in the tracking .. if the hinge weighs nothing it offers next to no resistance to being lifted by the lw ..

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[UbWe]

Here it is again Sam .. this time I added a "separator" between the yellow lw 1 kg and its red hinge 1 kg - in this case the distance between them does not change but I deactivated the separator anyway and tracked it .. if you watch the mid point of the grey separator (mid point on rod also) it would be where the COM would be for the combined 2 kgs - that mid-point COM swings like a pendulum until it can find a way to lose GPE, which you can see in the tracking .. if the hinge weighs nothing it offers next to no resistance to being lifted by the lw ..

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Aren't you going to support your friend ab hammer? It's a bit late to think you haven't supported him. I should be banned, right?

[Fletcher]

That looks a lot better, Fletcher. I think the the one one the right is the way it should be. The hinge mass is held up by the string. Sorry if I'm being picky--Sam (Or maybe I don't know what I'm talking about)

The problem we all have Sam is that only one person in history was ever struck by a bolt of divine inspiration (says he) with the mechanical answer to a runner ..

For the rest of us less fortunate we have to do it the old fashioned way - either decipher his drawings and "clues" to his answer, or nut it out for ourselves - and that means looking under a lot of rocks ..

Mryy is attempting to apply his logic, deciphering, and analysis skills to a combined answer - I post what I hope is educational material in his thread because imo he is sincere in his attempts and I don't want his thread and line of inquiry to wither-on-the vine from lack of interest or input .. ateotd I still think he will eventually have to sim or build something to test out his theories .. don't we all ..

[Robinhood46]

I imagine you have done one or two sims of MT24 in the past Fletcher.

Fletcher, have you tried adding an additional set of folding arms which interconnect the yellow weights, with no connection to the wheel/frame? Keeping all the existing connections as they are.
You may be able to achieve a sort of hovering behaviour as opposed to distinct back and forth. The backward motion of the swinging weight would no longer have a negative impact on the wheel, because it would be contributing to lifting the following weight.
Just a thought.

[agor95]

May I suggest we continue the MT25 on it's own thread?

That would allow this thread too follow the originators 'mryy' thoughts.

P.S. That is a good method; remove and see if it make a difference.

Regards

[Fletcher]

I imagine you have done one or two sims of MT24 in the past Fletcher.

Fletcher, have you tried adding an additional set of folding arms which interconnect the yellow weights, with no connection to the wheel/frame? Keeping all the existing connections as they are.

You may be able to achieve a sort of hovering behaviour as opposed to distinct back and forth. The backward motion of the swinging weight would no longer have a negative impact on the wheel, because it would be contributing to lifting the following weight.

Just a thought.

@ RH6 & Agor .. happy to take it to another thread - it was mryy who introduced MT25 here ..

Draw up a quick sketch RH and I'll see what I can do to replicate your intentions ..

[Robinhood46]

I don't know why but i can't share images anymore, only Youtube links.
I was thinking exactly the same linkage you have already, between one weight and one radial bar (the two folding arms).
Replicate this linkage between each weight and its neighbours.
If you can't get what i mean, no problems, i'll have a go with Algodoo, but i think we all know that Algodoo is WM2D for little children.

[mryy]

Mryy is attempting to apply his logic, deciphering, and analysis skills to a combined answer - I post what I hope is educational material in his thread because imo he is sincere in his attempts and I don't want his thread and line of inquiry to wither-on-the vine from lack of interest or input .. ateotd I still think he will eventually have to sim or build something to test out his theories .. don't we all ..

Much much appreciated Fletch. Very nice and kind of you to make time for this thread and keep it alive. It's only 9 months young and has garnered 28,346 views as I write! Not bad, not bad. You're right I am most sincere ... in making this thread the most popular ever on BW and expanding my fanbase exponentially! I'll let you all in on a secret: forget Bessler, the silly wheel and whatnot. I hope to win the popularity contest here -- shades of high school. Thanks Fletch and all. Let's make it happen! :D


It's fine Agor. Everyone is welcome to participate in this thread and learn. Or, as B. would say in MT36 infer as much as he/she can. Let's make it happen! ;)

[mryy]

For structural stability I added a second cross-rod to the corner of the stork's bill unit facing the wheel rim. See diagram legend on left. This will not obstruct the movement of the blade spring on the ascending side.

[johannesbender]

A very good example to use and perplex those who do not understand that unbalance or overbalance or rather torque because some things are a little more distant here than there , does not a runner make , all non runners alike has/have/had a need for a total amount of energy that is/were/are not available .

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5WYCcSMLoVE