Bessler's secret (probably)

[broli]

You say more friction is better? Wouldn't that cause less slipping? I'm thinking more Bull Shit would cause more slipping.

Sorry Broli; I think you are out of your mind-------------Sam

Rolling friction and Sliding/Slip friction are one and the same. The only difference is geometry which leads to more contact area. But if you zoomed in on a surface that is "slipping", like say your hands being rubbed together you would see more circles (ie atoms) as the picture attached shows. However because there are a lot more circles present there is a lot more contact area even IF the contact point is literally a single tangent point between a "line" and a circle. And the more you keep zooming in the more you keep finding circles riding on lines. THIS my shit slinging cowboy was not taught to you in school.

And yes you are in fact completely right, I am out of my mind I had to flip the switch in order to see what has been missed for so long but all I am seeing is shit slinging from your side, where is the mathematical, physical or simulation rebuttal? Talk is very cheap but throwing shit at each other is even cheaper.

Go to the marvelous invention called the toilet, leave your doody behind there. Then come back and contribute something useful as THAT takes much more time, energy and sacrifice. Do the hard painful work, put in countless hours and maybe, just maybe a light might go off on your ignorance as it did on mine and then come share your discoveries and maybe even get lucky enough for people to start calling you crazy because that is how you know you are on the right track.

[eccentrically1]

https://www.britannica.com/science/rolling-friction

[broli]

https://www.britannica.com/science/rolling-friction

The main source of friction in rolling appears to be dissipation of energy involved in deformation of the objects. If a hard ball is rolling on a level surface, the ball is somewhat flattened and the level surface somewhat indented in the regions in contact. The elastic deformation or compression produced at the leading section of the area in contact is a hindrance to motion that is not fully compensated as the substances spring back to normal shape at the trailing section. The internal losses in the two substances are similar to those that keep a ball from bouncing back to the level from which it is dropped.

Yes its amazing how far they can go in being correct and then slip up. Friction is at its core indeed the result of elastic deformation. The beaty of friction is the control we have over this deformation. We can make it as small as we want by using "hard" wheels for example. Or as soft as we want, and maybe even too soft by trying to slide a flat rubber sheet on the floor. This immense level of control allows us to use a simple rotational lever to perpetually deform "one" side of the dimension or whatever these "tracks" of nature are. And if you really think about it, all that seems to be happening is cold rolling. Two hard things pressing out something soft in between, space dimension pressing time dimension? I have no clue. Cant wait to see all the fun theories emerging from this especially from younger generations.

[Fletcher]

I think Broli that some of us are ingrained with the scientific notion that force is not energy, therefore it is very hard to shake that view and see any "force", including slipping friction force, as a mean to accelerate an object and give it velocity and KE ..

You may remember a garage crowd a while back ( a Dutch lot ) that reckoned they had a working wheel and that it worked by squeezing and spitting out a "cherry pip" weight - it may or may not have been similar to your proposal for self acceleration .. Frank Grimmer was in their corner but they suddenly went silent - I'm guessing they got ahead of themselves ..

Anyhoo .. I don't think WM2D is going to help you in this instance - the sim I did was paused when the force had exerted itself over 3 meters horizontal distance and the KE of the cart was about the same ( no frictions to speak of ) - even if I had just stopped the force after a certain distance it would not have continued to gain velocity and KE .. I don't think the sim can represent what you are hoping to demonstrate as an extra energy source ..

So, as you are planning, the only real option is a validation POP model and perhaps some photo-gate measuring etc ..

Best of luck wit the build as always ..

[eccentrically1]

Is there an MT drawing that shows a rotational lever similar to the cart under the board?

[Sam Peppiatt]

Sorry, broli, I n mean to piss you off. You are right, I was being a smart ass-----------Sam

[broli]

I am giving away too many secrets but hey there is no rules on giving stuff away for free.

I guess I will keep retrying until someone gets it.

Back to the hard mechanics of things I realized the rotational version of the rotational lever is much easier to grasp, but more importantly to animate. There is a cool little gear generator website (I hope someday it can get more dynamic features) where you see the magic in action:

https://geargenerator.com/beta/#hCDGFFB ... 6GFKSSh0yC

Here the inner most (sun) gear is fixed to the outside Ring gear. Then notice carefully how the second most inner gear interacts with the sun gear. And just to make sure you dont slip up again. The sun gear MUST be something soft or rubbery!

Its only shown as a gear in the above animation to show you EXACTLY how the planet keeps slipping through the teeth of the sun gear at a higher velocity. THIS is where the friction force comes from, this is the whole velocity differential that propels the entire thing forward. Its not rocket science just simple forces being applied, reflected and amplified, you guys where the force analysis experts or has this place made you rusty?

Anyway attached you see the force analysis and the end result. So again because you seem to keep slipping, the inner gear MUST be a soft material. Rubber, fake fur, hair, velcro (hair side),... whatever you choose as long as the planet gear can push through it and not lock up.

Dont wait on builds or someone's "secrets". You are getting all the information you need directly and the "secret" is right in front of your eyes and has always been "so simple a child could understand it". So simple that anyone who discovered it feared its ridiculous simplicity and got poisoned by greed. Or obfuscated it as code, in their manuscripts, their art, their patents, so much greed too much greed. But lets learn out of past mistakes and use our new chance, no more "secrets" as everything is lead bare in the sun for you. Just be careful of greed as the punishment is harsh as history tells us.

[eccentrically1]

It’s been speculated Bessler might have used gear trains to achieve the quick acceleration his wheels had. The weights themselves don’t seem capable of that much start up torque unless he was using a lot more than we think.
There are some MT drawings that have gear trains but the notes say the usual stuff - they won’t turn without his connectedness principle, etc.
Cool website.

[broli]

It’s been speculated Bessler might have used gear trains to achieve the quick acceleration his wheels had. The weights themselves don’t seem capable of that much start up torque unless he was using a lot more than we think.
There are some MT drawings that have gear trains but the notes say the usual stuff - they won’t turn without his connectedness principle, etc.
Cool website.

Please stop the idolization of alive or dead people it actually tourments their souls regardless of who it is. Remember their work, keep it in safe storage, display it in museums and move on. Think beyond hidden codes and drawings of dead people. Stop waiting for someone to "show" you their build. It will never run until it can run in your head and you UNDERSTAND why it runs. Sit down and use your analytical and judgement skills rather than jump around from idea to idea.

Take a pencil and piece of paper and just follow the forces around that are numbered in the previous illustrations to assist you for keeping track. Use the 3 simple rigid body dynamics force rules that I have shown earlier.

Any force applied to a compound RB applies...
1) a force on its centrer of mass or its contact point
2) a torque around it's centre of mass or its contact point
3) repeat rule 1 and 2 for all other attached rigid bodies untill you reach the last one

No puzzles or code just follow 3 simple rules and you will see that when you reach the ring and reflect back, the torque is amplified significantly ( Highlighted in yellow in the previous image) due to the reduced size of the wheel gear which therefore overcomes the initial "breaking" torque.

[Robinhood46]

Broli,
I think it is wonderful that you share your thoughts for free, and i would encourage everyone to do the same.
Sharing our thoughts is one thing, but insisting everyone agrees with them, is another.

I can't see why you are getting all excited, about some gears that make things go faster. I should think many, if not most members think the same about my amazing difference i believe to be fundamental. We see things that are brilliant from our perspective, and have difficulty understanding why others aren't able to appreciate them. It reminds me of a tale i heard many years ago about a racehorse.

To cut a long story short, an amazingly fast race horse caused the owners and trainers, and a few close friends who could be trusted, to lose all their savings and even their house for some of them.
It was the dead cert of all dead certs, because there was not a horse on the earth that could run faster than this horse, there wasn't even a horse that could come close.
On the home run, the jockey stopped holding the horse back and let it run at full steam, the crowd were so amazed by the performance of the horse, they all stood up and started clapping and cheering. The horse had never experienced this, because it had always been trained in secret, and was scared by it, it panicked, threw the jockey jumped over the rail and bolted.

We need to be sure of all the details, not just most of them, or only the ones we think important.
I can't see where you are hoping to find an excess, so I'm still not prepared to place a bet on your racehorse.
As always, i hope i am wrong.

[thx4]

The image of the beam is undoubtedly impressive, but in fact it's a simple gearbox differential.
B may have used this technique to gain speed from one point to another, why not, but how?

https://ahp.li/99844a4e99f3d33f3076.htm

[broli]

Broli,
I think it is wonderful that you share your thoughts for free, and i would encourage everyone to do the same.
Sharing our thoughts is one thing, but insisting everyone agrees with them, is another.

I can't see why you are getting all excited, about some gears that make things go faster. I should think many, if not most members think the same about my amazing difference i believe to be fundamental. We see things that are brilliant from our perspective, and have difficulty understanding why others aren't able to appreciate them. It reminds me of a tale i heard many years ago about a racehorse.

To cut a long story short, an amazingly fast race horse caused the owners and trainers, and a few close friends who could be trusted, to lose all their savings and even their house for some of them.
It was the dead cert of all dead certs, because there was not a horse on the earth that could run faster than this horse, there wasn't even a horse that could come close.
On the home run, the jockey stopped holding the horse back and let it run at full steam, the crowd were so amazed by the performance of the horse, they all stood up and started clapping and cheering. The horse had never experienced this, because it had always been trained in secret, and was scared by it, it panicked, threw the jockey jumped over the rail and bolted.

We need to be sure of all the details, not just most of them, or only the ones we think important.
I can't see where you are hoping to find an excess, so I'm still not prepared to place a bet on your racehorse.
As always, i hope i am wrong.

Thank you for this story and wake up call. Most ideas I shared in the past are garbage, I suck at teaching, I have no patient even with loved ones and I am too harsh. And I apologize if I tried to force my ideas or stories on anyone. I am really a pathetic human. However the only thing I have to offer are my ideas free of charge, but as you say, always criticize any ideas yours or not, dont just lazily follow or shoot them down, always validate, simulate and perhaps even build if you can. Do the hard and painful work. I try to follow these simple rules and still fail, this public stuff is honestly not my thing and like the horse I dislike big public crowds.

So will shut up for now. But if I may I want to leave with one last illustration, I dont even know anymore if any of this is correct anymore and perhaps I indeed am just deluding myself or went crazy, so do with it as you please. Garbage ideas or not, keep sharing your ideas with people around you freely when you are ready to do so, dont get poisoned by greed and become another story of failure.

Good luck and hopefully see you again.

[eccentrically1]

It’s been speculated Bessler might have used gear trains to achieve the quick acceleration his wheels had. The weights themselves don’t seem capable of that much start up torque unless he was using a lot more than we think.
There are some MT drawings that have gear trains but the notes say the usual stuff - they won’t turn without his connectedness principle, etc.
Cool website.

Please stop the idolization of alive or dead people it actually tourments their souls regardless of who it is. Remember their work, keep it in safe storage, display it in museums and move on. Think beyond hidden codes and drawings of dead people. Stop waiting for someone to "show" you their build. It will never run until it can run in your head and you UNDERSTAND why it runs. Sit down and use your analytical and judgement skills rather than jump around from idea to idea.

Take a pencil and piece of paper and just follow the forces around that are numbered in the previous illustrations to assist you for keeping track. Use the 3 simple rigid body dynamics force rules that I have shown earlier.

Any force applied to a compound RB applies...
1) a force on its centrer of mass or its contact point
2) a torque around it's centre of mass or its contact point
3) repeat rule 1 and 2 for all other attached rigid bodies untill you reach the last one

No puzzles or code just follow 3 simple rules and you will see that when you reach the ring and reflect back, the torque is amplified significantly ( Highlighted in yellow in the previous image) due to the reduced size of the wheel gear which therefore overcomes the initial "breaking" torque.

Trust me broli, if there's anyone on this forum that doesn't idolize Bessler, it's me.
And I don't need to see your build to know it won't run.
"Amplified" torque sounds significant, but it's not a secret. It follows the laws of motion like any other forces.
Perpetual motion by definition requires more.

[thx4]

Perpetual motion by definition requires more.

Searchers are found, finders are sought 🙂

[thx4]

Perpetual motion by definition requires more.

Searchers are found, finders are sought 🙂