Gravity motor motto...

[Georg Künstler]

Hi iacob alex,
the increasing Amplitude is the absolutely function which is needed.
I will prepare a picture how I think it can achieved.
Two special pendulums and a spring will be enough.
It is including the moving axle and allows a swinging in the room.

[iacob alex]

Hi Georg !
The increasing function ("amplitude"...) is related to PE into Ke.
About a vertical line free fall , we have :
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equatio ... lling_body
.....but to use /collect this motion , we play the free fall of an inverted pendulum "equivalence" , as a possible "self" repetitive process.
We can perform the tangential component of "g" , but also the radial component in a double oscillatory arrangement (as the so old shadoof...and tha Middle Age trebuchet , validated by the history of mechanics).
Try to move your imagination from a wheel concept to a simple variable leverage , intended to accumulate a torque difference on the same side of the fulcrum.
For the trebuchet-pendulum proposal we have a single "dispute" ,related to a possible continuous motion : to "remake" the top starting unbalance...as a "self".
We need , in my opinion to set it free the gravity...GIVE GRAVITY TIME/SPACE TO ACT !
Al_ex

[Georg Künstler]

Hi iacob alex,

iacob alex wrote:

We need , in my opinion to set it free the gravity...GIVE GRAVITY TIME/SPACE TO ACT ! "

I agree to that. In addition it must be an inverted pendulum and preloaded with gravity.

I will prepare a drawing how I see it.

[iacob alex]

.....simply , as a possible "self kiiking " game , with a spring mass system ,mounted on a pendulum.
Take a look at : https://youtu.be/TWbcsEDrmFE
.....then at : https://youtu.be/z6_NRNw88Jw
Al_ex

[WaltzCee]

For a joule today, I will pay you back two esday.

[iacob alex]

....."packing/wrapping" gravity free fall of a simple "elastic" pendulum arrangement ...if we start with a visual/real suggestion : a repetitive beach incoming wave at the seaside.
Take a look at : www.bowl4fun.com/ron/tip41_files/tip41.htm
.....with the ending point higher than the starting point...a clear "visual suggestion" to loop the loop in some manner ( descending, tumbling...or your idea ).
Al_ex

[Georg Künstler]

Hi iacob alex,
yes, you see how the movable suspension point creates a higher wave.
The direction of the movement of the suspension point has to be considered.

In one direction you get an damped oscillation, in the other direction you get an undamped oscillation.

What Bessler did is an combination of the swinging in x.y direction.
I the other example you had seen how an amplitude is rising when the rope is pulled and released periodically.
So you have the function up and down and also going left to right.
And the reversal down and up and right to left.

So moving the suspension point is an essential key.
The suspension point must be able to move in x,y direction.

[iacob alex]

Hi George !
Your comments : "...the moveable suspension point,creates a higher wave" , "...damped vs undamped oscillation..." is on the same line with "The Bessler-Collins Gravitywheel" ( www.besslerswheel.com/html/the_mechanics.html ) , as "...power arc vs momentum arc " of a pendulum.
For me , the half pipe physics of a skateboarder is a clear image related with the topic of a self speeding elastic/spring pendulum ( with a higher end point vs the starting point )...so the "mgh interdiction " of a gravity pendulum is "over" and we have the possibility to play "new cards / game" ! ?
By the way , take a look at double/triple pendulums :
https://youtu.be/DVr7KnpDAOc
https://youtu.be/J85gpcjvqzs
https://youtu.be/hXOEoH5q3Hw
The erratic motions of the pendulums are so provocative...to imagine a manner to "control " them...to obtain regular motion from this "chaotic world" , starting with an elementary elastic/spring pendulum !
Al_ex

[Georg Künstler]

Hi iacob alex,
the problem is hidden in only 2 pendulums.
In 2 pendulums changing their suspension point.

You had passed to me one video where one suspension point was manipulated by pulling and releasing the rope.
You had seen that this leads to an amplified oscillation.

With 2 pendulums we can achieve an self amplification when we change periodically the suspension point.

One is arranging the other. As in any other amplification the offset is 180 degrees.

This is the fundamental of the Bessler Wheel.
After the self amplification we must control the self amplification in a specific range. The controlled positive feedback loop is the next task.

[iacob alex]

Hi Georg !
If you take a look at:
https://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8638 .....or a proposal for a self-energized pendulums as a [spring-free sliding mass-spring ] in a tube suspended in the middle and a pivot , you have an image with :
-two potentially variable/spring pendulums back to back , playing gravity unbalance and rotational free inertia , following one another.
-one is arranging periodically the other ( offset is 180 degrees )
So , maybe we have a common verbatim...but different images?
All the Best ! / Al_ex

[Georg Künstler]

iacob alex,
we are on the same page, only the presentation is different.

It is not only that one is influencing the other, they must also change the suspension point in the x,y coordinates.

How this is managed I will show with a finger spinner.

I think millions of this toy is already selled.

So only the handling is different.

Everybody can follow up what is going on with the finger spinner.
I don't know if there is a patent on this toy or not, but we have the basic to demonstrate the self amplified oscillation.

I think the Bessler research group will find the owner of this toy.

I will open an other thread "Apologia and the finger spinner"

In endlish this is a fidget spinner.

[iacob alex]

Hi Georg !
Really , maybe we are on the same sheet , but with different contributions.
If you are interested about fidget spinner , take a look at :
https://youtu.be/ZFC6uaNXlr0
About my aphorism /motto regarding a possible gravity self-powered device , I see it as...a self rotating (tumbling , throwing oneself , self accelerating ) "springhtly " mass system (spring-free sliding mass-spring) , playing a continuous gravity variable unbalance and rotational inertia.
This simple arrangement is as a "vivid macro copy" of the atomic concept of mass , but...if it is self accelerating ( see the test...) , we need a loop control , as the next step.
Al_ex

[Georg Künstler]

Hi iacob alex,
we are on the same page when we try to get an permanent unbalance.
And I also agree that we need a loop control.

The finger spinner is one possibility to create an permanant increasing amplitude, therefore I have passed you that view.

The finger spinner has, which I have presented, has 4 holes with bearings.
The center of our rotation is in the middle.

You can position the finger spinner in a position that it is building a Y shape.
On the upper Y you can mount 2 weights.
This is an instable situation and the construction is top heavy.
One degree left or right, and the spinner will turn also left or right.
The Y will represent therefor a construction with a variated lever length.
The top heavy construction like to fail, left or right.
I will make some pictures so that you can see how the lever length is changed.

[iacob alex]

…..as a concise symbol / starting image ,at :
https://www.britannica.com/science/mech ... cillations
…..if we play a possible continuous pumping of gravity (tangential acceleration) and rotational inertia ( radial acceleration ).
Al _ex

[iacob alex]

…..starting with a a common oscillatory pendulum (playing tangential acceleration , only…), at :
….. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pendulum
…..then, take a look at 2003 forum’s suggestion (playing tangential and radial accelerations…one of them is related to the “so
…..called” PRIME MOVER !?) , as : https://www.besslerwheel.com/wwwboard/messages/657.html
Simply…we maximize a simple game with gravity and inertia …or play a double oscillatory configuration (pendulum…lever ).
Al _ex