the gravitational energy converter

[andyblues]

Nice to have you back George impressive builds as ever, happy new year, i don't quite have the time at present to evaluate your design but will get back to you soon, so glad to see a well built wheel thanks for sharing talk soon Andy ,oh happy new year to all, better late than never.

[SHADOW]

Bonjour George,
J'ai simulé le principe sous Algodoo, Le système se met en équilibre!
Je l'ai adapté au principe des rouleaux de Sam et il faut une légère poussée pour démarer.
A voir combien de temps la roue va tourner!

Hello George,
I simulated the principle under Algodoo, The system is balanced!
I adapted it to the principle of Sam’s rolls and it takes a slight push to start.
To see how long the wheel will turn!

[Georg Künstler]

Hello Shaddow,
many many thanks for the sim, very expressive.
what I liked to show in the previous post is that we have always a force on the rim.
The cylinder rolls on the rim.
The force on the rim varies, and therefore, we get contact at the rim at the 4 o'clock position.
We always have force in the 4 o'clock position. That point you have catched in your sim.

I
In your sim you have 4 arms, for the function we need only two.
Bessler said there are always two and two, so you can add more arms if you like.
Look at the sketch up.
The wheel is out of balance from the beginning. Think of a death wheel in the circus

[SHADOW]

Ok

[Fletcher]

Hi Georg .. If I understand you correctly you have 2 main variations on your Out Of Balance ( OOB ) design ..

1. Single Free-Rolling Wheel .. a single hollow shell section with a thin rim ( the 'outer wheel' ) is able to roll across a flat surface without deforming and with low rolling friction - inside of this circular structure sits a second shell section ( the 'inner wheel' ) that has the ability to roll inside of the outer - the inner has cross bracing and a center axle - to this axle is attached an 'L' shaped lever ( or can be 2 'L' shaped levers joined for rigidity ) which have masses attached at each end of the 'L' - one mass at the end of the short arm of the 'L', and another at the end of the long arm of the 'L' that acts as an internal horizontal roller against the inside of the inner shell - the proportions of the 'L' are such that the roller mass of the 'L' contacts the rim of the inner at the 4 o'cl position, and the short arm mass extends past the axle and downwards - the long arm of the 'L' shaped lever is firmly attached to the center axle of the inner - the attachment position for the 'L' is above the axle - the roller mass and the opposite short arm mass cause the 'L' to have a light touch ( because there is some counterbalancing ) proportional to their dimensions etc but there is a net torque against the inner rim ..

2. Stationary Revolving Wheel .. essentially the free-rolling single system above is duplicated and mounted on opposite sides of a stand mounted wheel with center axle able to rotate if torque is applied ..

Georg .. I assume you haven't provided dimensions and magnitudes because it is not critical to its operation ( if it is please give them ) - I will attempt to reproduce the arrangements described above in sim form and see what it predicts will happen when the sim is run ..

[Fletcher]

Do you agree this is your generic "inner" arrangement Georg ?

If we can establish that it is, I can move on to the rest of your designs ..

..................

[SHADOW]

Algodoo Sim

[Georg Künstler]

Hi Fletcher,
yes, the internal construction is like this.
the cylinder is rolling on the rim, the rim is a circle representing a hole.
In the circus it is a cage. You can create the internal construction as an object and later repeat it always 2 and 2.

for shadow,
look at that video, we have a cage, and in this cage the L-shaped holds its position.

The movement you will see in a wheel of death,

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/x5CEkALX ... ture=share

The wheel has many holes where the L-shaped pieces are active.
Two are enough to show the function.

the wheel has many holes

[Fletcher]

Hi Georg .. first, thanks Shadow for taking the time and making the effort to make a sim for us to study ..

ETA .. OK, took a closer look at some others pics in the thread again and Shadow's is the correct interpretation ..

[Georg Künstler]

The L-shaped arm and the rolling cylinder are correct in the sim.
They roll always to the 4 o'clock position.
Both Shadow and Fletcher did it right.

What is wrong is the attachment of the main arms to the rotation axis.
The L-shaped arm can then be putted into that hole, circle.

I drawed it up for clarification.

only one turning axle

[SHADOW]

Sims

[Georg Künstler]

Hi Shadow,
you used yellow for the ring and green for the bar.
The green bar in your drawing is to long.

The green bar must be connected to the yellow ring like this.
The internal construction of the L-shaped construction in the yellow circle is correct.

yellow rings and green bar

[Fletcher]

Hi Georg .. you can see how difficult it is for Shadow and myself to get everything right the first time without your clear instructions ..

* Just looking at the circus wheel format to keep it simple .. *

=> The bottom attachment is your recent drawing with some additions and labels by me for clarification purposes ..

Please take a close look at it to see if it is correct - I have drawn your blue L's as black L's and put them inside your rings - especially the fact that the L's rest on top of the axle and are pinned to it where they touch ( shown by white triangle ) ..

I also included some thin green horizontal lines from the main L weights ( arm weight and roller weight ) to indicate the turning moments in each ring - to naturally rest ( with the same/equal turning moment ) at 4 o'cl against the ring the L weights would need to be of slightly different masses I would guess - to drive against the ring ( with physical contact ) at 4 o'cl the roller weight would have to have the greater turning moment until it descended enough vertical distance that the turning moments from arm weight and roller weight were equalized ( balanced ) if I am not mistaken ..

For the circus wheel format we are now discussing there are no inner rolling rings pushed by the L's as there was for the earlier roll-aross-the-floor single wheel format !?

Do I / we have the construction detail and the proportions right now ? .. thanks ..

.....................

[Sam Peppiatt]

I'm thinking about it Georg. I'm thinking that it's not working------------------Sam

[Georg Künstler]

Hi Fletcher,
your drawing is absolute correct now.

As you can see, we have the L-shaped weight lying on the axle;
therefore, the rolling cylinder is pressed against the rim of the circle and is rolling upwards.

The forces from gravity are acting on this sub-axle and the rim.
In fact a force, which is normally on this sub-axle alone is splitted in this two forces, sub-axle and rim.
Look at the distance between a cylindrical weight on the left and also on the right side to the main-axle,
and you will see that the distance from the cylindrical weight on the left is shorter than the distance of the cylindrical weight on the right side.
Representing a short lever on the left side and a longer lever on the right side.

That the l-shaped weight is steadily rolling upwards always to the 4 o'clock position is a function which is stabe and can repeated several times.
It holds its position when the main axle is turned, it stable holds the 4 o'clock position.

I think that Bessler has seen the clock in Praque where 12 holes representing the time, and in this holes there were movable figures,