The problem with Patents...

[AgingYoung]

Jester,

I've posted this before but since your just reading this very lengthy forum I'll repost it. They make clays used in claymation that melt when heated. That's the best kind of clay to use. It won't dry out on you.

I've made clay models of parts and fitted them together to be able to visualize what they would look like. I've also made moving parts with cardboard to be able to look at the motion. If you get creative you can learn a lot from your ideas before spending a lot of money on them.

Also wm2d is a good tool. I prefer something I can get my hands on.

Gene

[AgingYoung]

Jester,

When you're making your part you can imbed hardware in it. You might put a bolt or nut in it so that you have a way to fasten it. The hardware also gives it more strength and acts as a filler. You'll need less of the epoxy.

Gene

[Jester]

DonÂ’t think the Bicycle wheel is going to work for me. Too many spokes to put the bits round the middle.

Could be a good idea for John for the Christmas market though!

Perpetual Motion Kit

One copy of "Perpetual Motion: An Ancient Mystery Solved?"
One wheel with bearings.

[DISCLAIMER: Internal components not supplied!]

:)

[Paul]

I wonder whether patenting a machine which provides little energy and is very cumbersome and heavy has sense. Can a machine such to that of Bessler at the day of today be successful on the market?

[jim_mich]

Paul,

It's a matter of economics. It all boils down to "Can the wheel save you money?" and "What is the payback time?"

I burn about 3-1/2 tank fillups of propane each year to heat my home. The last fillup cost me about us$700. My electric bill is about us$60 each month. So I spend about us$3170 a year for energy to heat and light my home. Assuming 10 percent rise in energy cost per year I will spend about us$10,500 (or about us$292 per month) over the next three years. If someone had a wheel that could supply my home's energy needs and offered it for us$12,000 (fully installed) then I'd buy it. If I took out a 6 year loan the payments would be about $200 a month. This makes economic sense. I'd be saving a little money now and a lot of money later on. Another scenario might be an installed rental wheel for say us$180 per month.

A more expensive wheel would have less change of success.

[rlortie]

Jim_mich

Your above scenario makes sense, but I believe you are forgetting to add the payback where as you would probably come out way ahead.

I cannot speak for the laws in your area. Here, any green earth produced energy that can be tied into the grid must be purchased by the involved utility service you are connected to.

A wheel large enough to heat and light my home means that there would be surplus power during the off-peak usage. This would be fed back into the grid. Your meter would run backwards. If you produce more than you use, you get paid for it.

I appreciate and know that this is a descriptive statement, it is intended for all to understand and I do not question your smarts.

Ralph

[jim_mich]

Ralph,

I didn't forget the 'green earth' laws as I'm well away of them. I didn't (for simplicity) include them in my scenario.

Selling power back to the grid would/should lower other peoples rates. Those with wheels might end up supplying New York City or Tokyo?

Home heating can be averaged out by storing heat in heat accumulators constructed from rock, water or earth filled insulated bins.

[Jester]

Hi Paul,

I think alot of people make the assumption that at the end of day the wheel will be cumbersome. I very much suspect however that the internal parts are scalable to produce the same RPM as the larger versions. Put that together with mounting ten or more per axel and you're starting to amass quite a powerful portable power unit.

I believe this would make patenting more than worthwhile.

Jester

[Fletcher]

You need two meters installed Ralph (& guess who does that ?). One is the ordinary meter in. The other is the meter feeding power back to the utility company. They won't reimburse you at retail rates (as in winding back the meter) but at wholesale, hence two meters required.

[rlortie]

Fetcher,

I agree you are not going to get paid back what you spend. Here the wholesale rate is set by federal power grid. There are several wind farms one coal burner and three natural gas plants. We also have one private owned hydro plant where a farmer damned the river running through his property.

I believe that your electricity is 240 volt at 50 Hertz while our normal house current is 220 at 60 hertz.

As for needing two meters I have always been told that if the supply exceed the demand the meter would run backwards. I will have to check up on this with my local utility office.

One thing for certain your "sell back" had better be in phase with that of the grid.

Ralph

[racer270]

i have a neoghbor who spent 20k on a rooftop system "solar" the local power company subsidised 10k of it, he has two meters, after 10 years of no electric bills he figures he just made his first 100 dollars. it took years to break even and he gets about a hundred bucks a year now.