Another gravity wheel?

[jim_mich]

Duh, you cannot just toggle a spring on and off in real life machines. I wish it were possible. I'd put a real strong spring in each engine cylinder and turn it on at the top of the stroke and off at the bottom. For each compression you need equal decompression.

[LustInBlack]

Well I thought he had two springs that were successively used in the simulation ..

Duh...

[LustInBlack]

Some constructive thoughts, I had an idea that may work but be more complicated..

A double pivot..

Your Arm, the two extremities (A and B). A to the left of axle, B to the right.

Add another Stop for the movement explained below :

When bottom side of your arm touch the axle, it engages Side B in a pivot, the other pivot (Side A) would unlock, releasing the arm on the other side (Side A).. The same arm would be used two times each revolution ..


I should draw it ..

[LustInBlack]

Sorry for the Triple post..


Here is the drawing, hope it helps understand ..

I didn't draw a trigger mecanism for the pivot......

[jim_mich]

Even better. I'll use two springs. One to push the cylinder down then one to push it back up.

My point is when you tell wm2d to make a spring active or not active then the tension becomes instantly available even though you did no work to stretch or compress the spring. It's like you reached in and moved the spring manually each time. That manual effort takes affect just the same as if you kept manually giving a real wheel multiple pushes.

[LustInBlack]

I don't know, I never thought of doing that, knowing it would be "cheating" ..

I thought the idea was to switch spring .

anyways .. .

Looks like the members of this forum are acting in collective anger...

[Jon J Hutton]

Maybe I should clarify why I used two springs and how they work. Sorry for the confusion this has lead to.

In my wheel I built with just one arm I used a weak rubberband that held the weight, a pointed plumb bob against a screw and gave it a little push...say starting around the one o'clock position. When it went around to the 9 o'clock position gravity unlocked it from behind the head of the screw and the bar hit against the threaded hub and it made 3 more revs. At first I didn't understand what was happening. now I think it has to do with the same thing that keeps an ice skater spinning the closer their arms are towards the center of axis. I noticed that if I let the plumb bob just hang by its own weight it would pull on the rubber band until it was actually level with where it would release from...this was good news because it wouldn't take much energy by a counter weight to capture it again. I didn't have a way to simulate this on wm2d ( or I couldn't think of one) until today when I decided to use two springs to simulate the movement only ( that was all I was after to see if it would produce more energy each rev). I thought that perhaps everything would go great even if the capture and release could be worked out but I was concerned it would come to a screeching halt when I move the weight back to its starting point. The Double spring idea of turning one off and the other on again and then repeat the process was the only way I could think of, of simulating a capture and release...I didn't think it would be "cheating" because the spring is connected to the wheel that is turning. It produces just the same as it did in real life when I ran the actual test. I did find when I manually turned on and off the springs to simulate a solenoid that the speed soon would not let the bar unlock or release.....

Hope this clears some details up.

JJH

[Jon J Hutton]

Be glad to post the program..once again just let me know.

[LustInBlack]

Jon : What do you think of the double pivot idea?! .

I'll try to create a latch mechanism for the privot that will take no energy ,


I think it could be done easily by gravity alone ..

[Jon J Hutton]

LIB,

Your going to have to explain it another way or draw it out for me...I just can't quite see what you are saying. Interesting no one is commenting on this..or they are researching it out, or distracted with Mr. T. I almost wish I hadn't posted it because the more I work with it the more promising it looks.

JJH

[rlortie]

Hang in there Jon, the orchestra is just getting tuned up. IMO forget the latches and the springs. a double pivot is not the answer either.

You already know the results of one lever, Look back and ask yourself was the spring that was acting like pulling on your boot straps really necessary to achieve the results noticed?

Ralph

[ken_behrendt]

Jon...

I decided to see what would happen if I took two of your long lever mechanisms and mounted them in opposition on a single wheel. The results are attached below.

I could not get a single complete 360° out of the system!

I am not optimistic about this approach...


ken

[Fletcher]

Yep, Joel Wright might have some observations or shortcuts for you Jon.

[LustInBlack]

Ok I've tested the double pivot, looks like it still have to lift on 1/2 of a rotation .. I got 3/4 + dust of a turn .



Ralph : Please test before saying it's not the way to go .. You may have knowledge, but I think you believe too much you have the answer (Not unlike some other members) ..

[Jon J Hutton]

Ken,

You didn't test it right by what your output graph showed. Remember, I can get 5 turns with just one arm.....what aren't you doing...I don't know, but something must not be set up right. Maybe I have the advantage because I actually built it.

JJH