After my research...

[jonnynet]

Hello!

After a longer time of deep research I am finally back. Someone here said that the secret will discovered still before this year ends. So you hope I can now present you the solution?

I wished I could do so but I failed. There are some new designs and not only on paper - most of them I tried to build. But unfortunately either the wheels doesn't work because of mechanical failure or because the design was only worth for the trash bin. Therefore I cannot prove yet that the right concept is already in my mind.

What is to do now? I have prepared the website http://www.secret-of-perpetual-motion.net where I will show these designs bit by bit. Now you'll find nothing on that site but in a few days I'll begin, step by step. Then you can use this thread to discuss all the new stuff.

And in the future I plan to present the finally working wheel there, together with a detailled construction guide to recreate the wheel easily.

A good new year to all
-Jonny-

[Patrick]

Hi Jonnynet;
Good luck with your research! I will keep my eyes on your new website, thanks for sharing your ideas.
Happy New Year!
--Patrick

[jonnynet]

Unfortunately I had to close my website because of private reasons. But it doesn't matter, I want to share my ideas anymore. Therefore I have added the contents here. Please let me know your opinions. These two designs are the most important ones:

Description for wd01_12:
8 angled levers (3) are pinned to the wheel drum (1). The driving ring (4) is pinned to each linear end of an angled lever. The pendulum ring (2) inside the wheel drum rests on the angled levers and swings a bit to the right and to the left during wheel’s rotation. It causes the angled levers to keep the driving ring at the right side. Because of the special shaped levers, the pendulum ring remains centered.

Description for wd02_12:
The wheel drum (1) and the cylindrical disc (3) rotates around the same axle but the disc isn’t fixed to the wheel drum so it can rotate with another speed. The 4 weights for stabilisation (6) are pinned to the wheel drum. The bolts for it are also used by the driving weights (5). Each of its ends are connected to the ring (2) by a connection rod (7). They pushes the ring against the cylindrical disc and they’re prevented from falling down. The weight for stabilisation is to maintain the whole structure. Its fork keeps the connection rod’s pin centered. As long as the wheel doesn’t lose the shown structure, it should be in imbalance.

[jonnynet]

No comments? No opinions about the two designs? I have the feeling something is wrong. You think I keep a secret to myself? If you don't understand the working principle you might ask.

[bluesgtr44]

Hey Jonny....The first one is symetrical all the way around. The asymetry you are looking for is going to be the ring pushing on the levers and trying to keep the weight to one side. How is it going to stay to one side? The way I see it as drawn, it will balance out real quick. Ring hanging on the levers and the smaller ring will be bottom dead center.

I tried a quick representation of this in WM2D and it wouldn't work. I may be missing something in your thought pattern on this. I only used four levers, but the concept was the same. I tried to push it to one side with a pendulum and it just sat, pushed to one side and nicely balanced.

If the riding ring is going to keep the OOB, what is keeping the riding ring OOB? Do you see the dilema?


Steve

[jonnynet]

I tried a quick representation of this in WM2D and it wouldn't work.

At first: forget WM2D! It is nice to test some simple things but unusable to simulate a whole wheel design correct. As soon as a design is a bit more complex, WM2D failed (my own experience!).

I only used four levers...

That's too little. At least 8 levers are necessary for the function. As more levers you use as better it works. You know the ring must not touch the bottom of the wheel drum. The wheel that I constructed had 8 levers and it failed because of another problem: The levers weren't angled.

How is it going to stay to one side?

The ring pushes the levers all the time with its own weight and as long as one lever is pushed at least, the other ring will keep on the right. Of course, to do so the condition is that it's heavy enough.

If the riding ring is going to keep the OOB, what is keeping the riding ring OOB? Do you see the dilema?

What's OOB? Sorry but I am not informed about such abbreviations.

[Gregory]

Out of balance jonnynet...

Have a look at here: http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... breviation

Anyway Wm2d has Accuracy settings. Certainly it has a limit, but if you adjust the accuracy settings for custom and accurate, then it can handle a lot more without problem. You only have to wait if you work with complexer designs, because the program calculates more on higher accuracy settings.

[KAS]

Hi Jonnynet.

Nice design.

Put me right if I am wrong here but..

The sub system with the 2 weights (5 & 6) doesn't look as though it will hang like that in reality.
Wouldn't it be at an angle as the combined mass of the 2 weights find their own centre of gravity.

Or am I missing something?

Kas

[jonnynet]

@Gregory
Thank you! Then I can also use these abbreviations in the future.

I know about the option to set own accuracy values in WM2D and I have done it often. But nevertheless I observed many glitches especially with the use of rounded shapes.

The sub system with the 2 weights (5 & 6) doesn't look as though it will hang like that in reality.

The weights 5 and 6 are not fixed together, they just uses the same axle. So weight 5 will not lift weight 6.

[jonnynet]

Sorry, an unanswered question is still remaining.

If the riding ring is going to keep the OOB, what is keeping the riding ring OOB? Do you see the dilema?

The riding ring (I called it the pedulum ring) itself doesn't need to be OOB, it's always centered. If the wheel is in rotation it will move to the right and swing back at the same time. That means it's only centered during wheel's rotation. So it applies its force vertically.

[jonnynet]

Okay, let's continue the search.

Currently I concentrate about the problem of a self-shifting weight and I want to know what you think about the following statement:

If we lift a weight with the help of another one and that will only move at the vertical line, then we'll have success.

Do you think so too?

Now I work on a mechanism where no counterweight will be created during the lift of a weight. Or rather I have invented such a mechanism and several tests with WM2D gave me the green light.