simple logic tells me gravity is not conservative!

[DrWhat]

True Ovyyus,

like most of us I was absolutely convinced my previous designs would work but once built the flaws were clear. Build, build build. That is the only way!

I feel like we are at war with gravity, fighting it, trying to outwit it. It thinks it has covered all its bases, that we can't possibly defeat it. Gravity was momentarily upset by Bessler, it was but once defeated. It had a flaw, something it missed. It now feels safe as the secret was lost. Gravity is saying "I have thought of everything, every option"... except one.

Each time we try to find a way, gravity find it's own way to counteract our method. I am annoyed with gravity. Doesn't it want some glory? The be king? To be front page news.

I hate you gravity. But I don't want to!

Months of pondering, a miriad of possible combinations and permutations: this turns that, that slides there, that bumps into that... There must be a way.

Yes I've found it, the answer, they joy, then the delusion, later the cursing. Hours passed, tools bought, splinters, cuts, poor sleep. Damn you gravity, how I hate you, but I don't want to!!

[ovyyus]

Gravity was momentarily upset by Bessler, it was but once defeated...

Sorry, but I think Bessler's secret had nothing to do with gravity.

[graham]

I feel like we are at war with gravity, fighting it, trying to outwit it. It thinks it has covered all its bases, that we can't possibly defeat it. Gravity was momentarily upset by Bessler, it was but once defeated. It had a flaw, something it missed. It now feels safe as the secret was lost. Gravity is saying "I have thought of everything, every option"... except one.

Nicely put DrWhat.

We keep searching, looking for gravity's Achilles Heel and it's there,somewhere, deeply hidden,waiting.

Graham

[graham]

Sorry, but I think Bessler's secret had nothing to do with gravity.

I'm surprised you haven't left the door open just a crack Bill.

Graham

[Georg Künstler]

Hi DrWhat,


Gravity is saying "I have thought of everything, every option"... except one.


you asked the right question and
the solution is simple, the exception is: gravity can only be beaten by gravity. Gravity beats itself. Self defeating.



the future has begun

Georg

[Bessler007]

Yes but like so many simple ideas, their execution seems impossible.

A gravity powered wheel is like two cats in a wheel. As the wheel turns one cat gets its tail run over and it screams a forceful meow causing the wheel to turn! Then the first cat rests as the second cat takes a turn. It's like that except there are no cats.

In other words the kick occurs within an always balanced wheel (or close to balance).

[Bessler007]

Hello Arthur,

I've had this gimpy graphics editor I've never used and thought I'd try it out. :)

There is a cycle in the life of a crank. When someone first begins to look at the idea of motion they see what seems to be very mysterious things. Everyone goes through that. No one was born Einstein. Even Einstein wasn't an Einstein. Not many know this but he was left on the back porch in a basket.

A difference of forces cause motion and masses in motion can come together creating a force. Our universe is a coherent cause/effect assembly of pure motion from the electron to the cosmos.

The ancient Greeks speculated matter could only be divided to a point. That philosophy was latter confirmed when we discovered the atom. As we began to look further and with more resolution we found atoms were made from very strange, quirky particles. The atom, it turns out isn't the smallest piece of matter. What we 'know' is dynamic. That leads to the question, 'do we really ever know?'

I'll pose a question, Arthur. What is the cause of the constant, invariable, eternal force of gravity? Gravity does vary as you vary distance but if the distance is constant so is the force. You don't need to know its cause to try to replicate Bessler's wheel but it is something to think about. What is the energy that causes the force of gravity? Bessler claims to have asked the cosmos and then got an answer in a dream. Who knows. :)

All I'm trying to say is that gravity is a source of energy.

I think gravity is a force bounded by awesome motion.

[10x]

All I'm trying to say is that gravity is a source of energy

Correction. Gravity is a force that can be used as energy. This is simple shown as potential verses kinetic energy of a falling object.

Take the pendulum. To keep it going takes less energy than starting it. this is due to the force of gravity. So far only one person has claimed they can use such as a hammer.

I am looking at a variation and some experiments on such. One thing I can see is the object to keep in motion with possible acceleration, must already be in motion to part energy from such to it.

[arthur]

Gravity is a force that can be used as energy

yes,
I'll go with that. that is what I meant by saying "gravity is a source of energy."

[arthur]

Sorry, but I think Bessler's secret had nothing to do with gravity.

If not able to operate horizontally,

then the operation of bessler's wheel had something to do with gravity.

[ovyyus]

Arthur, if the energy source driving Bessler's wheel (his secret) isn't gravity - which IMO it can't be because gravity is a conservative force - then any number of wheel designs based on his principle, both vertical and horizontal, would be possible. Therefore, gravity would have nothing to do with the secret.

[10x]

[edit by scott: quote below by arthur on page 1]

of course distance is involved, in this case it is just not relevant to the definition of work.

What?

[scott]

10x, I had to go back to page one of this thread to find the source of your quote.

http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... 2970#42970

Please don't be lazy or obtuse from now on.
Thanks,
Scott

[arthur]

disregard that statement. it is irrelevant.

I hope someone here understands the point I am trying to make with this thread. So far it appears that maybe no one does. oh well.

[DrWhat]

Don't give up Arthur!