Chas Campbell Motor

[HUMBUGGER]

Yeah Ralph, I read that today. He was later accused by someone of being me! He's not me, but I thought what he said was right on the money and I think it's part of why Stefan decided to start the idea that I had been insulting Gaby (after erasing the "evidence").

So...was MEG and Bearden close to what you were getting at?

Humb

[winkle]

ralph
i have never in my life ask a question that required an answer that long
nor have i ever in my life read an answer that long
and i am to old to start now

[Fletcher]

LOL :7)

[rlortie]

humbugger,

So...was MEG and Bearden close to what you were getting at?

Exactly! We both studied out of the same books and the same years. He in Army me in the Navy.

I see now were there is an attempt to smear you over at Evgray, another forum that I have gotten bored with some time ago.

Ralph

[HUMBUGGER]

Yep...evgray guys seem to worship Ashtweth/Epi without question. I also got in big trouble for asking Hector what his source of information was on a claim of a 1.5 pound 1000HP motor. Seems it's a religion over there as well. Asking for evidence to these guys is absolute heresy it seems.

There they routinely accept claims of huge overunity from Bedini-type motors, Panacea RV setups, etc. But somehow self-running and/or good demonstrations or even measurements done on video are totally absent.

It is an honor to be ostracized by such a group.

humb

[ovyyus]

...so far, all I've seen are delusions and scams and the same story dressed up a thousand different ways.

Unfortunately, that's also my experience after many years of searching. 15 years ago I was a close associate of Robert Adams, now deceased. You may have heard of him and his motor/generator? My relationship with Adams and his company ended badly when I eventually discovered a fatal and fundamental flaw in his work. The dream was over. He tried to keep me quiet about it but I felt we had no choice but to go public with the findings. He and his other colleagues disagreed. Long and sordid story.

Anyway, through my efforts with Adams I was granted an inside look at the free-energy 'industry', both here and in my travels to the US. I was told privately by key players (some were/are 'greats' in the field) that "playing the game" was the key to successfully selling books, lectures, doco's, articles, plans, etc. Playing the game was a really simple plan. Not my cup of tea though.

It appear's that not much has changed in the last 15 years except the means used to promote and market this hype. Today there's income stream websites promoting the same dressed up rubbish to even greater audiences who are told to believe in ignorance and conspiracy and to distrust 'established' knowledge. All part of the game. The tactics appear to have changed little in dealing with dissent among the ranks - censorship and personal attack. Standard politics. When I read your comment about feeling honored to be ostracised by such a group, it hit a chord.

[Michael]

Epi did when he joined - about how he went to the same school as Prince Charles, when someone ragged him about his grammar & sentence structure

That would be me, and I was about to do it again but thought why bother.

[coylo]

Coylo,

Quote:
I think Epi is genuinely passionate about new energy technology, green issues and generally making the world a better place


And that is why he would have been my last choice to be the one to do an analysis's of Campbell's claims. I would say that he is a little biased wouldn't you.

I have stayed somewhat clear of this issue as I did not wish to pass judgment on a member at the bottom of the barrel. EPi, added my name and standing to his group and promised me by private post that he would keep me informed of any findings. I have heard nothing!

Ralph

OK Ralph, I see your point... a passion that leads to bias, then blind delusion.
But the difference between you and me Ralph is, that I think I got a good nose for these fraudulent folk and time wasters, and I let them know about it. Where as if I and other members hadn't got on Epi's case, he'd still be hear cutting and pasting, charlatan BS!... and you Ralph, would allow it to happen until you become a member of their private message posting club!

I had to say that Ralph, because when you said...
"I have stayed somewhat clear of this issue as I did not wish to pass judgment on a member at the bottom of the barrel..."
I don't think it was a good call. How long does it take and just what needs to take place for you to make a judgement on such issues???

Epi did when he joined - about how he went to the same school as Prince Charles...

He also mentioned something along the lines of his father owning half of Fiji???
Although I take Bill's point.

[jim_mich]

These above few comments go toward explaining why Bill attacks my CF idea. Since I've not disclosed my concept (due to patent laws) and can only discuss them in general terminology, and because I've not finished my test wheel yet (life get in the way and gobbles up most of my free time) so that I can't prove yet if they work, Bill considers them wild ass speculations without any basis in truth. Wagner did a similar thing to Bessler (except it was after Bessler had a working wheel) where Wagner didn't understand how the inside of Bessler's wheel worked and since an overbalanceing wheel is mathematically impossible Wagner assumed that Bessler was a liar. Bill (and most everyone here) doesn't understand how my wheel is proposed to work, yet that doesn't stop Bill from attacking my idea.

PS. Bill, I have no problem with you being a skeptic. You do a good job. Skeptics are good, as long as they keep on open mind and understand that they might not know all.

[rlortie]

Coylo,

and you Ralph, would allow it to happen until you become a member of their private message posting club!

First I consider this an assumption on your part. I have no idea of what you mean by; I am member of their private message posting club????

I am not aware of any such club, and I certainly do not belong to any. If you are referring to my comment that Epi, notified my that he had added my name to his so called web list of learned people then yes, he did so state. What this list is and what part I am supposed to play is a secret to me. There has been no farther communication except for a statement that he would keep me informed of the Campbell tests, which did not or has not materialized.

If you check last nights postings over at ou, you will find where he admits that the Chas Campbell Motor is a dud! This surprised me as I am sure it did a number of his opponents.

Yes I can spot the fraudsters, but I am patient about jumping in to soon until any benefit of doubt has left my gut feeling. I find that one must define ones personality traits before judging there actions.

Ralph

[ovyyus]

...I can't prove yet if they [jim's CF idea] work, Bill considers them wild ass speculations without any basis in truth. Wagner did a similar thing to Bessler...

Jim, you admit that your CF idea remains unproven - it's just an idea.

If you think there's any similarity between Bessler and yourself and myself and Wagner then I can only wonder where this conversation might take us next.

When the day comes that asking questions is considered an attack, then all is surely lost. Haven't I already said to you that I hope you might, against all odds, be right? Haven't I already wished you every luck in your attempt to prove your "wild ass speculation"?

You dare to suggest that my mind is closed when you're clearly so sold on your own CF idea (IMO improbable) to the exclusion of all else??? Wasn't it you who recently stated in connection with an idea that was different to your own, "Try designing such a wheel. I've tried and it can't be done". Laughable, Jim.

Theories are candidates for truth; they may be proved true or false.
Hypotheses are judged by their utility; whether or not they are helpful in an investigation.
Fictions belong to the realm of art.

You have presented no theory that may be proved true or false and your hypotheses appear inconsistant with observation. ATM Jim, I'm forced by lack of information (typical in this field) to relegate your idea to that of fiction, at least until something further comes to hand.

[rlortie]

Jim_mich,

Bill is certainly not the only skeptic here regarding your CF driving force claims. He is just the most outspoken about it.

You have not to my knowledge posted any form of accreditation that would or could lead into a theory or hypothesis for a CF powered machine.

Now I know you could care less about what I think, but if you have something and do not wish to reveal it, then cease writing about it. Ignore any mention of it. Use the time spent here in a pissing match for proving your alleged claims.

If you have something then why are you spending valuable time here debating the skeptics without yet revealing anything in your favor.

Quite often I find myself biting my tongue, I want to announce to all that I believe I have something. But I know it is to soon or third party intervention tells me to keep my mouth shut!

Ralph

[jim_mich]

Sorry Bill, I didn't mean to upset you. I guess I worded my post wrong. All I was trying to say was that when a skeptic looks at a subject and assumes that he knows most everything about the subject (like Wagner did, like you do concerning CF and many OU claims, like I do concerning ambient air pressure/temperature and gravity turning a wheel) then the skeptic may arrive at a wrong conclusion when all the information is not known. Being a skeptic requires weighing the probabilities of something being true or false.

I kind of like Sherlock Holmes approach...

“How often have I said to you that when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth?�

“It is an old maxim of mine that when you have excluded the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.�

“... and improbable as it is, all other explanations are more improbable still.�

“We must fall back upon the old axiom that when all other contingencies fail, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.�

“When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.�

[Michael]

This is really the improtant part isn't it.

When you have eliminated all which is impossible.

[ovyyus]

Jim, I'm not upset by your post, just amazed at your sensitivity and defensive attitude when it comes to your current pet idea! Perhaps I shouldn't expect you to be too objective, but experience tells me that's exactly what you need to be.

the skeptic may arrive at a wrong conclusion when all the information is not known.

This sceptic is simply reacting to information made available to him by you. Your idea is based upon the well known fact that doubling the speed of a mass results in a squaring of it's available energy. While that relationship is well known, you seem to perceive it as something more. You claim it will lead to energy creation based upon your concepts of Aether energy and how that might work. Yet you offer no tangible evidence that this notion might be true. What am I to think, Jim?

Michael is right when he implies that your quote is inaccurately applied. I think that until such time as all possible means have been exhausted in the search for replication of Bessler's demonstrations, then improbable approaches appear foolhardy at best. But then, I'm only interested in replicating Bessler's demonstrations - I'm not trying to prove some idea of PM. Perhaps that's where we differ most?