Weights

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rlortie
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re: Weights

Post by rlortie »

Pete.

I agree with Jim, Centripetal is a true and usually a physical connection between an objects axis or point of rotation and the mass that is rotating about it.

Centrifugal force is that property which pulls on the physical connection keeping the radial rotation in place.

As for Coriolis force, I do not see the relevance of it in a gravity wheel. See the below quote from Encarta
Coriolis Force, also Coriolis acceleration, in mechanics, additional force or acceleration acting on the motion of bodies in a rotating system of reference. Thus, an object moving above the earth in a generally northerly or southerly direction, and with a constant velocity relative to space, will be deflected in relation to the rotation of the earth. This deflection is clockwise in the northern hemisphere and counterclockwise in the southern hemisphere. The effect is named after the French physicist Gaspard de Coriolis, who first analyzed the phenomenon mathematically. Coriolis forces are of considerable importance in determining prevailing winds and ocean currents and also in the analysis of the flight paths of missiles and rockets.

"Coriolis Force," Microsoft(R) Encarta(R) 97 Encyclopedia. (c) 1993-1996 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.
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re: Weights

Post by Clarkie »

Thanks Jim/Ralph.

I just wanted to make sure I was on the same page.

I believe it is possible to lift the CoG of a mech by rotating a weight from 12:00 to 6:00. I'm working on it now.

Pete.
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re: Weights

Post by rlortie »

Some second thoughts about Coriolis force related to a gravity wheel.

A wheel or drum is turning, a weight is dropped from 12:00 it falls vertical. It will not land at what was 6:00 because the wheel has turned as the weight fell. Same result as found in Coriolis force on a planetary scale.

This is not true Coriolis force but rather a reference point that has changed. Next point is, can this be put to any advantage in a design?

What if the weight were to fall upon a stepped platform decreasing its lifting radius. This of course does not explain what is going to lift it, but it is food for thought! Perhaps the platform is a lever which throws (catapults) the preceding weight even higher.

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re: Weights

Post by wheelmaster »

Ralph

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A wheel or drum is turning, a weight is dropped from 12:00 it falls vertical. It will not land at what was 6:00 because the wheel has turned as the weight fell. Same result as found in Coriolis force on a planetary scale.
Is this something along the lines of what you are saying. They way it works or in this case does not work is once the weight reaches the top of the enternal wheel it drops into a tube. The rope pulls the back of the pendulum.
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"I then reminded him to harness the horse in front."
- Johann Bessler
rlortie
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re: Weights

Post by rlortie »

wheelmaster,

No this is not what I am saying, no tubes no pendulum. Just an example of a falling weight within a reference point in motion.

A communication satellite is in a fixed orbit and is always pointing at the same ground reference. It is not when being launched or falling back to earth. The earth is revolving the satellite is not rotating with it.

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Re: re: Weights

Post by P-Motion »

Wouldn't it be funny if Bessler covered his wheel to slow it down. I could see the irony in it.
Weight can be used to act as a governor.
Fletcher wrote:That is a possibility but somewhere in answer to a witness he said that no such subtifuge was used & that the weights were the essence of his PM principle, in & of themselves [paraphrased].

So if force of gravity [i.e. accelerartion due to gravity of an object] is the same for all objects with mass [regardless of the amount of mass] & the PM principle comes from the weights themselves, then a differential force must have been created thru movement, that wasn't directly tied to acceleration due to gravity.

As we all understand, objects always have Inertia which is proportional to its mass. Here's the interesting bit. If you apply a make believe constant acceleration force to an object its rate of increase of velocity is proportional to its mass i.e. the more massive the slower the rate of change of velocity, in all directions.

However, gravity ignores an objects mass or Inertia & a constant accelerating force due gravity changes the velocity of ALL objects at the exact same rate of change, when falling in the field. Most unusual to say the least.

So, if gravity [acceleration due to ..] is just a field of force which pushes things downwards at the same rate of acceleration [simplistic analogy] then there is nothing to be gained by way of direct differential from the force of gravity, as there isn't one, & mechanical leveraging/repositioning alone can't give that differential to create constant OOB.

That leaves the only other major player - Inertia - which could be said to be a bodies resistance to change in direction or velocity. Energy [1/2mv^2] is required to change a body's inertia so the amount of energy to do that is directly proportional to the body's momentum increase or decrease.

Imo, somehow Bessler was able to use gravity to get something moving/swinging [knowing that the momentum gained from gravity would be exactly recovered later]. Then, some arrangement of CoG neutral weight pairs was caused to morph/rotate [from the CF generated] creating an Inertial Hammer to do work via Kinetic Impact. The design of the Inertial Hammer [as it gained momentum] had little effect on the swing mechs Center of Gyration, not slowing it much. The Kinetic Energy from Impact was channelled to change the swing mechs CoG allowing it to swing to a higher Potential Energy State within the wheel, with the process repeating on the back swing.

An "Inertial Impellor" literally.
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