Impact can be absorbed by springs. This will spread the force over a short period of time while the spring compresses and decompresses as it bounces the weight back in a reverse direction. If the weight hits an 'anvil plate' on the spring then you will hear the sound of a weight gently hitting something within the wheel.
By using a spring you get a gentle impact that does not beat the wheel to death. It is a perfectly logical method of transferring motion of fast moving weights into wheel motion.
jim_mich wrote:...
Impact can be absorbed by springs. This will spread the force over a short period of time while the spring compresses and decompresses as it bounces the weight back in a reverse direction. If the weight hits an 'anvil plate' on the spring then you will hear the sound of a weight gently hitting something within the wheel.
By using a spring you get a gentle impact that does not beat the wheel to death. It is a perfectly logical method of transferring motion of fast moving weights into wheel motion.
You don't want to absorb d³x/dt³. You don't want to attenuate it. You need to amplify it. The more of a hammer blow it is, the better. That's the whole point.
The wheel has to be made capable of absorbing these hammer blows. Eventually they will lead to fatigue failure of the weights/anvils but these can be replaced.
If you think about it fatigue failure is brought about by d³x/dt³ in contrast to creep failure which results from d²x/dt².
Who is she that cometh forth as the morning rising, fair as the moon, bright as the sun, terribilis ut castrorum acies ordinata?
The spring absorbs the impact and then gives the energy back over a short period of time. Very little energy is lost. Almost all of the energy of the impact gets transferred into the spring and then on to the wheel. The spring acts like an accumulator of kinetic energy. It receives the impact and passes the energy on to the wheel over a short period of time instead of all at once.
This short period of time is the time required for the moving weight to decelerate and then accelerate back in a reverse direction. The characteristics of the spring and the mass and speed of the weight determine time and distance of the weight bounce. If the mechanism can actually produce or harness extra energy then a small loss within the spring makes little difference.
fwiw ,i believe you have to strike a unique balance of the forces involved , going radical will fail .
1 , slightly over balanced .
2 , slightly out of balance .
3, moderate impact .
4 , moderate CF. so keeping the speed low to allow everything to function , yet still taking advantage of CF .
I built a setup like this about two months ago. It was a relatively crude model that allowed impacts on one side that "shock loaded" that side of the wheel while the other sides weights were eased into their positions by springs. Anyway, it wasn't a runner I think mostly because its movement was too jerky (losses) and I was having a hell of a time fine tuning the springs to all work the same however I can definitely see how this jerkiness could be smoothed out and how more eccentric weight could be added to the system theoretically creating more output. Remember, Bessler said that his wheel's power was proportional to its diameter. My test wheel (which has now been dis-assembled for parts) was only ~12" dia.
BAR wrote:I do not understand how you guys think you can gain energy from impacts? Please explain.
No energy is gained from impact. Energy is transferred by means of impact from a fast moving weight to a slower moving wheel. The gain in energy comes about before the impact. The gain of energy is in the fast moving weight.
An impact has to be absorbed into the wheel. If it is too hard it will bounce and you will loose any true gain do to excess vibration. I have seen these types of vibration and they will stop a movement cold.
Otherwise I think magic would be ok with me. LOL For if we have a running wheel it would be a kind of magic. ;)
Grimer wrote:I notice you don't put your profession in your profile, BAR.
I hope you don't mind my asking but are you a chartered engineer? Or the US equivalent?
I like to keep some of my life private at this time. I am already some what fearful of saying things that could get me in trouble. Especially after what I have read of others experiences on the members only forum. I am not an engineer. I very much like science and math though. Simply, if all my statements are incorrect about physics please state your arguments. :)
BAR wrote:I do not understand how you guys think you can gain energy from impacts? Please explain.
In the case of this particular experiment of mine I didn't really have any rock solid idea of the underlying physics of why it would work, I just based it on a sort of "gut feeling" I guess. I actually went to college for technical theater, behind the scenes sort of stuff. This involved alot of rigging and if you've done alot of rigging you know not to drop a heavy weight at the end of a string or a cable suddenly. If you do, you run the risk of "shock loading" the line, putting a much heavier impact on the end of your line possibly pulling you over or breaking the line. I guess it all comes down to the increased force caused by acceleration of the weights on one side of the wheel. Theoretically amplyfying the weight. Sort of a G-Force Effect (?)
