Did Bessler discover the "Ekman Spiral"...before Ekman?

[ruggerodk]

Bessler mention of "Vorticis Verticalis" in Apologia (see image below) has puzzled me for a long time since the rotation is in the horizontal plane (vertical axle) which is directly opposite of the wheel itself (horizontal axle).
But also, I can't see how this vertical vorticis could be achieved....unless - ofcourse - you make each weighted crossbar screw itself up and down through the center axle.

Apart from this one think strike me: Why is the "e" in the word "applicirte" in another typographic...?
Maybe this would be interesting for John Collins....in his search for hidden codes...?

The Ekman Spiral or Ekman Transport is an interesting phenomenon that seems to explain fx how water can run uphill....and more importantly: How a ship on sea moves at a right angle to the direction of the surface flow.
The same physics also explain the movement of water below the ocean surface: The net motion of the upper 100m of the ocean is at a right angle to the wind direction

http://earth.usc.edu/classes/geol150/st ... ocean.html

If anyone have some more information on this I will be happy to hear of it.

Thanks
ruggero ;-)

[AB Hammer]

ruggero

Thanks for bringing this up. It is interesting.

[Stewart]

Apart from this one think strike me: Why is the "e" in the word "applicirte" in another typographic...?

All words that are not of German origin are printed in a Roman typeface and not the normal Fraktur typeface. This was a perfectly normal thing to do in Bessler's time. However, whenever different German endings were added to these words then the Fraktur typeface was used for the ending. So there is nothing particularly unusual about the 'e' at the end as it is a perfectly valid part of a German adjective ending tacked onto a Latin word, although it's more common to see the 'rte' or at least 'te' in Fraktur and not just the 'e'. See the attached image from an another German book (nothing to do with Bessler) dated 1727, where you can see the 'te' is in Fraktur and the rest Roman.

Stewart

[ruggerodk]

Thanks Stewart...now I can tick off that puzzle;-)

Then we just need to solve how
"vertical vorticis" could ever be achieved (or what it has to do) in a wheel with a horizontal axle...?

Any suggestion?

I myself have one: A scissor jack in the form of two circles; that is, one horizontal disk suspended from another disk, by cords or rods.
By turning the lower disk, it will elevate itself.....

regards
ruggero ;-)

[Grimer]

The Ekman Spiral or Ekman Transport is an interesting phenomenon that seems to explain fx how water can run uphill....and more importantly: How a ship on sea moves at a right angle to the direction of the surface flow.

The same physics also explain the movement of water below the ocean surface: The net motion of the upper 100m of the ocean is at a right angle to the wind direction

http://earth.usc.edu/classes/geol150/st ... ocean.html

What an interesting link.

I especially liked the bit about the 2 metres high hill in the middle of the Atlantic. ww

[ruggerodk]

Can anyone tell me if this is spelled right in German? (from the image above)

Especially the words "die Welle" and "Lasten"...

"/ noch andere von aussen an die Welle oder Axin ihres Vorticis Verticalis applicirte Lasten / mit bewegen und treiben müssen."

I know a lot of people have translated the Apologia, but some original words are obviously – for some unknown reason – dismissed and erased in the translation.

fx. the words "noch andere" ("still other") and "an die Welle oder" ("on/to the shaft/wave or")

To me it sounds like Bessler are saying clearly, that loads from the outside is applied to the shaft or axle (via the secret prime mover mechanism) by a "tornado" kind of spinning....which drive the wheel and move with it.

regards
ruggero ;-)

[bluedanube]

"/ noch andere von aussen an die Welle oder Axin ihres Vorticis Verticalis applicirte Lasten / mit bewegen und treiben müssen."

That is perfectly german written, and what the image shows.

bluedanube

[ruggerodk]

Thanks bluedanube,
That brings me one step further ;-)

As you are from Austri you can perhaps tell me if I'm right suggesting that the word "ihres" is connected to the word "andere"...?

ruggero ‚-)

[rlortie]

ruggero wrote;

Bessler mention of "Vorticis Verticalis" in Apologia (see image below) has puzzled me for a long time since the rotation is in the horizontal plane (vertical axle) which is directly opposite of the wheel itself (horizontal axle).
But also, I can't see how this vertical vorticis could be achieved....unless - of course - you make each weighted crossbar screw itself up and down through the center axle.

MT #136 depicts such a mechanism.
http://www.orffyre.com/mt121-143.html

Ralph

[ruggerodk]

Yes Ralph, it does.

Others like MT41 and MT42 are very much showing the direction in which we are to apply that very principle.

Look for a "Vorticis Verticalis" and tell me what you find....

But still...it's not perfect yet.

ruggero ;-)

[Ed]

Speaking of MT136, please check out this thread about it.

http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... 1273#61273

While posting about MT55, I came across a few images for MT136 that were easy to just post now.

[bluedanube]

the word "ihres" is connected to the word "andere"...?

It took me a minute to figure out, your image does not show AP but DT.
So to answer your question, I had to read the whole context, which I attached now.

The red marked "ihres Vorticis Verticalis" relates to "Tympani oder Rades", if I understand the old german correct,
and means "it's - the wheels Vorticis Verticalis"

The yellow marked "ihres Gehäuses" relates to "Gewichte",
means the "their casing/housing" - "the weights casing/housing"

The green marked "andere" relates to "aplicirte Lasten",
means "other than the weights / additional applied loads"

(page 21) in a structure or framework, and coordinated
in such a way that not only are they prevented from
attaining their desired equilibrium or ‘point of rest’, but they must
for ever seek it, thereby developing an impressive velocity which
is proportional to their mass and to the dimensions of their
housing. This velocity is sufficient for the moving and raising of
loads applied to the axis of rotation.

bluedanube

[Stewart]

I disagree bluedanube - the red "ihres Vorticis Verticalis" also refers to the weights. "Tympani oder Rades" is in the previous sentence. This sentence is about the weights. I would translate it something like this...

"...and at the same time in their admirably quick flight, according to the proportion both of their own and of their housing's size, must move with and drive other loads applied outside at the axle or axis of their vertical vortex."

their = the weights'
vertical vortex = the rotation/orbit of the weights vertically (i.e. with the wheel)

Stewart

EDIT: Just to point out more clearly that, judging by previous comments, you seem to be taking "Vorticis Verticalis" to mean a vertical axle/axis when I think it actually means that the axle/axis is horizontal and the weights are rotating vertically around it (basically a description of the whole machine/wheel as we see it oriented in the images).

[Grimer]

Just to point out more clearly that, judging by previous comments, you seem to be taking "Vorticis Verticalis" to mean a vertical axle/axis when I think it actually means that the axle/axis is horizontal and the weights are rotating vertically around it (basically a description of the whole machine/wheel as we see it oriented in the images.

That fits with both the Keenie and the Vesica designs so it makes good sense to me.

[Grimer]

I think what one is homing in on here is that the Ekman, the Keenie, the Vesica, are all manifestations of the the conservation of angular momentum, a more fundamental law than the conservation of energy since it is based on angular velocity which is objective and independent of the observer rather than linear velocity which is subjective and dependent on the observer.

Linear velocity is relative and will remain so until people recognise the existence of an absolute from of reference for linear velocity. Angular velocity isn't since people have no choice but to recognise an absolute frame of reference for angular velocity. It's so bloody obvious, isn't it.