sorry

[carloluna]

sorry.
http://picasaweb.google.it/118040514380 ... 7223722594
the red lines are poles moved by cylinders attached to ropes .
how to upload images directly into the post?

[DrWhat]

delete

[carloluna]

delete: you can explain better?

[Trevor Lyn Whatford]

Hi Carloluna,

I am not to optimistic, but it must be tried as it looks good, an old bike wheel and some bits of metal and string, you will soon see, it will save time that could be lost arguing about it.

Regards Trevor

PS use add an attachment.

[jim_mich]

how to upload images directly into the post?

Click Here or Here for instruction of How to Upload Pictures.

[DrWhat]

carloluna.

Come stai?

Volevo dire che questo disegno l'ho gia' visto, pero poi ho capito che hai aggiunto un' altro mechanismo!

Si puo' solo valutare se viene costruito, pero' penso che stai ricreando idee che si sa gia' che non funzionano.

Pero' sempre idee buone che ci fanno pensare.

Complimenti

Damian

[Jon J Hutton]

Hey,

Jim, wasn't this one of your first ideas many years ago.

JJH

[jim_mich]

Stefan Hartiberlin posted the link to this image back in 2004.



Jonathan then uploaded the image to the forum with some modification.

I then did some analysis.

I think the idea is ancient.

[DrWhat]

In Italian (just for fun) I told carloluna that it is an older idea but that he added arms to it. The modification won't improve things much I'm afraid. But hey, he may as well build it!

[carloluna]

this is the wheel of Edward Somerset Duke of Worcester
published in his treatise in 1600.
Bessler said to be started from this wheel for his discovery
the wheel consists of a system of weights always a balance between the right and left

but

I added a second system with rotating arms with tip weight ,attached to the wheel spokes
the second system can not remain in balance.
the arms are pushed outside by the cylinders of the first.
my virtual devices use this idea

http://picasaweb.google.it/118040514380 ... 80/Desktop#

unfortunately do not work :the work produced by the second is equivalent to that required by the first
but this is the way .
something missing

other considerations:
Children play among the pillars
with loud heavy clubs(bessler):the pillars are formed by cylinders .....

Weights acted in pairs
- Bessler:as in my case

Weights came to be placed together, arranged one against another.
- Bessler :as in my case

Weights were heard hitting the side of the wheel going down.
- eyewitness accounts:as in my case

Springs were employed, but not as detractors suggested.
- Bessler :the pair is a spring

the system is very simple
count carl:as in my case

anyway I'm happy to have changed after 400 years the wheel of Somerset.

if my idea is old you must demonstrate

my best regards

[teokox]

Ciao Carlo,
il mio consiglio è quello di non perdere tempo con questo tipo di soluzioni e disegni. Sono tutti sistemi di tipo chiuso che non possono funzionare. Questi sistemi funzionano solo per il tempo necessario a consumare tutta l'energia iniziale ricevuta. Un sistema chiuso potrebbe diventare, almeno in teoria, una PMM (non una OU) solo se tutti gli attriti e le forze contrarie sono nulli. Dal punto di vista scientifico e filosofico potrebbe essere interessante ma da quello pratico completamente inutile.
Soltanto i sistemi di tipo aperto possono generare energia (mediante un processo di trasformazione).
Bessler o ha trovato una soluzione utilizzando un sistema di tipo aperto o era un truffatore.

tk


Hi Carlo,
my advise is don't waste your time with this kind of solutions and designs. All of them are based on closed systems and cannot work in any way. These kind of systems work only for the time needed to consume all received input energy. Theoretically a closed system could become a PMM (not an OU) only if all frictions and contrary forces are null. Scientifically and philosophically this could be interesting but completely unuseful for practical uses. Only open system based can produce energy by a transforming process.
Bessler or found a solution using an open system based or he was a scammer.

tk

[carloluna]

grazie per il consiglio.
che cosa significa sistema aperto?
forse i bracci devono dondolare liberamente nella direzione del moto
e bloccarsi nell'altra?
se si ho una idea.

thanks for the advice.
what means open system?
Perhaps the arms should swing freely in the direction of motion
and stop the other?
if yes i have an idea.

[teokox]

Hi Carlo,

An open system can exchange forces and energy with the external world (eg. wind mill, water and steam turbines, batteries, solar systems, nuclear plants and so on).

All current working devices are open system based. Wind mill needs wind to produce energy, water turbine needs the water flow, batteries needs a battery charger and so on. Whitout the "fuel" the devices don't work and become closed systems.

All gravity machines that I can see (from Bavaria Magic Wheel to Bhāskara II to Leonardo Da Vinci to Path_finder etc.), try to use the gravity as fuel, but in a closed and passive mode.

IMO the solution is looking for a new open way to use gravity that could exchange energy and forces with the external world.

Which are the differences from gravity and the wind for a wind mill?
1) direction (horizontal vs vertical)
2) medium (physich vs aetheric)
And for a cascade? Only the medium.

I hope this clue help you with your designs.

tk

[carloluna]

I want to share some wm2d
(Even stupid or funny).
I want to see yours.
I propose a contest with different categories wm2d
: Artistic, funny, inventive, etc.

[bluesgtr44]

Hey Luna, here are some things I've messed with.....


Steve