Question for John Collins

[grim]

Hello John

Were Karl's exact words "carpenter's boy" or "carpenter boy"?

Thanks


grim

[John Collins]

Hi Grim,

Fischer von Erlach wrote to Desaguliers, Sir Isaac Newton's curator of experiments, and I quote the English version, " His Highness, who has a perfect understanding of mathematics, assured me that the machine is so simple that a carpenter's boy could understand and make it after having seen the inside of this wheel, and that he would not risk his name in giving these attestations, if he did not have knowledge of the machine."

I have a copy of the original letter but please give me a day or so to find it and I shall quote from it.

Kind regards

John C.

[John Collins]

Here is the same quotation from Fischer's letter in its original French.

"Son altesse qui possede parfaitement les mathematiques,m'assure que cette machine est si facile qu'un garcon de menuisier la fauroit comprendre, & la faire apres avoir vu le dedans de cette Roue, & qu'il n'auroit pas expose son nom en donnat des attestations, s'il n'avoit pas eu connaisance de la machine."

The bold words literally read "that a boy of a carpenter ".

John C.

[Jonathan]

So does it mean a carpenter's apprentice?

[John Collins]

Yes I think so Jonathan. I can't think of any reason for saying the son of a carpenter, so I'm sure that he meant a carpenter's apprentice. Apprentices were commonly used at this time through out Europe and were taken on at a very young age - in London as young as twelve and released from their apprenticeship on their 21st birthday. So the term "boy" was probably used to indicate that the internal structure was simple to understand.

John C.

[sek]

G'day to everybody. I read with much interest and dismay this quote that it was so simple that a carpenter's boy could build it! Also did not Bessler or someone else say that anyone who creates the overbalanced wheel will fail? And also wasn't the comment made that his detractors or others were trying to make wheels within wheels and all other sorts of different arrangements and this too wasn't it? I mean we can send people to the moon, space probes to Mars and beyond in our solar system, we can split the atom and still we cant solve something thats right under our feet ( no pun intended) pulling us all down! Does anybody else feel like me sometimes when I try to use common sense and logic about all this? It's all so very frustrating, so pleeeease could someone crack it soon before I go insane!! I'm lost with it all and I need to get help.
good luck everybody! bye.

[Jonathan]

I think a better version of Environ's device would be promising. I've done some math that say it would work. Then again it is 4am...
It is frustrating isn't it? There are only three things that give me perserverance here, God, the convincingness of Bessler's story, and another that is too long and hard to explain, but summed up is: optimistic experimental evidence.

[Nitro]

Don't go NUTS on us Sek.

Its not the construction that is difficult, Its the Mechanics.

[Trev]

A problem cannot be solved with the thinking that created it.

[Jonathan]

That doesn't make sense, it isn't mechanic's fault that there are no PMM. It is not a being, it can have no faults beyond incorrectness. It is the fault of those who do not try and those who found it but did not share. And that's only if it's possible. If not, then there is no fault on anyone.

[Nitro]

Jonathan.

Who are you responding to?

[Jonathan]

I was responding to Trev, sorry I didn't make that clear.

[Guest]

Mr Collins,


For those who have not purchased the book can you please give insight on the following.

Plate 85 page 27 in J Cs book. Cheeky, smiley chappie on a pendulum giving it a sneaky kick ?

Thank you

[John Collins]

Guest wrote

For those who have not purchased the book can you please give insight on the following.

Plate 85 page 27 in J Cs book. Cheeky, smiley chappie on a pendulum giving it a sneaky kick ?

I don't think there is more to read into this picture than what you see. The foot which you say is kicking the wheel is the one which is away from the wheel and in my opinion the picture just shows a way of driving a wheel with a relaxed and smiling man who is also enjoying a swing. The kicking foot is operating the swing in the usual way.

JC

[Stewart]

Have you noticed the striking resemblance of the man in MT85 to the jester on the MT toys page? This guy (lets call him Smiler) obviously did a lot of modelling work for Bessler and wore a range of stylish outfits ;)
Could Smiler be a link between the mechanisms on each page (i.e. the pendulum, or perhaps the linkages) or is he just there for our amusement?

All the best
Stewart