2 rlortie

[Jim Williams]

Flight
Wild North American Male Turkey in Atlanta, GeorgiaWhile large domesticated turkeys are generally unable to fly, smaller, lighter domesticated turkeys known as "heritage turkeys" and "wild turkeys" can fly. In domesticated turkeys, the ability to fly depends directly on weight, while even heavy adult wild turkeys can fly well enough to avoid predators by taking off and flying up to 100 yards (90 m) and perching in tree branches. Turkey poults (goblets) cannot fly for the first two weeks after hatching

Wikipedia

[James.Lindgaard]

That's hilarious. So some turkeys (small ones) can fly. WOW!!!!!!!!!
Heck, the Wright Bros. improved their flying ability from about 125 feet to much more.
If only turkey's had the sense to better develop their flight capabilities.
Okay, now I know you guys will do research for arguments sake. Still doesn't say much.
Okay, I just got that one. People from Ohio can improve on what they do. But as your friends with Jim_Michingan, I dunno, can't think of good insult here without insulting my own country. Didn't serve in the military to do that. Did serve to protect your right to say what you like, 1st Amendment.
It's a shame a disablled vet doesn't share that same right.

[rlortie]

I guess these last few posts show what you and your friends know.
Only negative comments.

My friends have seen nothing because you are on their ignore list. that means that your posts do not exist on their monitor.

I thought this was Scott's forum but I guess ralph has taken ownership of it. I mean really, when has he ever posted any of his own work ?

This is not my forum, my forum is under Groups and only invited members can access it. It does not really matter as I have taken an extended winter respite and for now it is dormant!

Please be advised that 'James.Lindgaard' will now be going on my ignore list, your above post under this name will be the last one I see.

Ralph

[Jim Williams]

Ralph

15 years ago I was actively pursuing my own ideas on how to build a PPM until I found a patent (3,412,482) that convinced me that it had already been achieved. Having a patent of my own, (3,200, 421) I was unaware that patents could be granted on devices that didn't nessisarily do as advertised and ended up here at Bessler's Wheel promoting this invention.

It was here that I learned; a. patents don't nessisarily mean the invention works and b. that PMMs have yet to be discovered. I've had an on and off relationship with this site ever since.

Within the last six months I decided to pursue a new patent on a new invention of mine, obtained a patent attorney and after a patent search, am currently writing the description for the attorney to fill in the claims. It has nothing to do with a PMM, Arrache or this site and I would be more than wrong to reveal it.

In the interim, I posted a music video here, almost as replacing posting my new invention here.

The reason for this post is to make clear to anyone that my posting a music video was in no way meant as an insult to this site or anyone here, but, at worst, was an expression of the pleasure and realization I have experienced from my having been a member of this site.

Jim Williams

[Reticon]

Wow, that was quite an episode. So what if Bessler was like him? Just saying...

edit, figured out the timestamps.

[ovyyus]

Reticon, Bessler may have been as mad as a meat axe but there is no comparing him with this episode because, unlike our current protagonists, Bessler demonstrated an actual working model.

BTW, I'm still interested in how you think Bessler might have pulled off his demonstrations based on him being a fraud. If it was a trick then how did he do it?

[James.Lindgaard]

I guess these last few posts show what you and your friends know.
Only negative comments.

My friends have seen nothing because you are on their ignore list. that means that your posts do not exist on their monitor.

I thought this was Scott's forum but I guess ralph has taken ownership of it. I mean really, when has he ever posted any of his own work ?

This is not my forum, my forum is under Groups and only invited members can access it. It does not really matter as I have taken an extended winter respite and for now it is dormant!

Please be advised that 'James.Lindgaard' will now be going on my ignore list, your above post under this name will be the last one I see.

Ralph

>>My friends have seen nothing because you are on their ignore list. that means that your posts do not exist on their monitor.
<<
Then all it can mean is they need attention for doing nothing. That is sad, very sad. After all, they post because as even Jim_Mich said, I posted somehting so he posted an ignorant comment.
That's where I am bored today so can enteertain you guys some :-)
I know you guys are bored or otherwise you wouldn't take such an interest in me. You literally have nothing better to do. So much for being Mr. Money Bags with the respectable business :-)

Bye

p.s. It is your forum Ralph. If you're unhappy about something, everybody else is also unhappy with it. It's by your word.

edited to add; when I first posted in this forum 4 or 5 years ago, I had people tell me they would rather see you build Bessler's wheel because you don't use math. They liked you because you did not discuss the specifics of how it worked.

@Retilo,
Sorry if I got your name wrong but Bessler could have gone through what I've been going through. You guys don't care how the wheel works, but if you can get lucky, you'll take it and be happy.
With me, the reason why I would know how it most likely worked is because of the amount of work I have put into studying his drawings among other things. I have done a lot of math to better understand how the mechanics would need to work. Nobody else has put out this effort, nobody.
And for me, a working wheel would not be as nice as knowing why it works. You guys would just say, see this thing here it does that, just kind of ne it would. Kind of like being smart enough to understand this is not the result of hard work but because some peple would just think they're that smart.
And the icing on the cake ? Having to do the design work and then the manufavturing process to build it. That is a lot for one person to do while some people just like being a problem. Don't worry, I don't think you're one of them, but the amount of work this requires kind of kills it.
And this is where if what I'll be doing works, JW and people like him can say, but Ralph likes me :-)
I would just wonder why they would want it to be that way. Support Bessler in word but support his detractors by deed.
I think that last part is just something I was hoping to avoid but know now that it can not be.

[James.Lindgaard]

Reticon, Bessler may have been as mad as a meat axe but there is no comparing him with this episode because, unlike our current protagonists, Bessler demonstrated an actual working model.

BTW, I'm still interested in how you think Bessler might have pulled off his demonstrations based on him being a fraud. If it was a trick then how did he do it?

ovyyus,
Like I said, All you guys can do is talk trash. And Jim W asked why you guys would be jealous ? Because you guys don't have a clue.
And as to what I showed ralph, he has already debunked it previously using his and Alan's Keel Effect.
The only thing he can say now is that I was on the right track but him and alan made everythng much more difficult.
Of course, for their friends, that would mean take a chance like Ralph's friend Ken who supported my work in another forum. But you guys aren't like him where he can respect soemone's work regardless of what Ralph says. LEMMINGS !

[jim_mich]

If it was a trick then how did he do it?

Bessler posed the same question to Wagner. And Bessler then answered, saying that it was impossible to make a wheel self turn like his wheels did (that is, with the same strength and for the same long amount of time) unless the principle of PM was known.

[James.Lindgaard]

Reticon, Bessler may have been as mad as a meat axe but there is no comparing him with this episode because, unlike our current protagonists, Bessler demonstrated an actual working model.

BTW, I'm still interested in how you think Bessler might have pulled off his demonstrations based on him being a fraud. If it was a trick then how did he do it?

ovyyus,
Bessler didn't demonstrate a proven wheel. If he did, this discussion would not be happening.
And as the one guy mentioned, is history repeating itself. If so, then you guys are the detractors. And it would show only one thing, the more thiings change, the more they stay the same.
After all, if what I am doing works, you guys will just come up with new things to say about me.
You know, like why did he put so much effort into it when it's so easy anyone could build it.
But you know what, i will make friends from this. They'll be the ones who like knowing why it works so they can play with the engineering more, see what they can get it to do.
And yep, posting in this forum has alwaays been a waste of my time. Like Ralph used to tell me, i am an idiot becausse of my spelling even though English is my second language. Guess that makes my dad an idiot for moving to America, right Ralph ?
And yes, the posts are still there.

[Reticon]

BTW, I'm still interested in how you think Bessler might have pulled off his demonstrations based on him being a fraud. If it was a trick then how did he do it?

Sorry if I missed your asking this before, I have mentioned some ideas in previous posts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not leaving out the possibility that he had it, I just believe the PHYSIC-al evidence is to the contrary.

So, at risk of having you lop off my head, here are my current suspicions:

1. The 3 ft wheel was moved by the maid as she said she did. She probably did exaggerate her story to include the castle and other instances, but she probably thought it was fine considering she knew the first was a fraud. "People lie." - House M.D. Wagner probably wasn't too far off on how it worked.

2. The larger wheels were designed for specific demonstrations. For longevity perhaps a clockwork, I'm convinced the sealed castle room was a special type that "hibernated" for a set period of time and spun back up again. All possible, albeit quite complicated, given known physics. In fact, his need to "check" on it was probably a guise to insure that the timing would be just right. It's all about controlling the situation. If Mylow were more careful it would have taken much longer to debunk him. If Mylow fell and hit his head there may well be a Mylow forum too.

3. The switching supports display is, in my opinion, the most interesting. I'm suspicious that he had springs inside of the cylindrical weights. They could be cranked down and acted like batteries. Perhaps with a ratcheting internal mechanism that when tapped returned a bigger tap. We all know that is all it would take. Especially if it does little work. That would be what he allowed Karl to see.

I won't extrapolate too much further, only to say that the incident with sGravesande is very suspicious. Destroying the wheel makes sense in exactly one case, and that is to hide any evidence of fraud that sGravesande may have found. If Bessler really thought that Willem had gotten some magic principle then keeping the wheel would have served as evidence that it was stolen from Bessler. Therefore destroying it was almost certainly the act of a paranoid con fearful for his head. (i've had one of these threaten to sue me!)

I know what I'm proposing means Bessler was a genius anyway. If he precisely machined hollowed weights with preloaded springs even by today's standards dozens of those lasting 2 hours would be impressive. Especially if done under load. In fact they could be marketed as a life saving device for ships at sea! However, if he had a stack of them to switch in and out as he wanted under the guise of "minor repair" then he could keep feeding it power for as long as his supply lasted and then head home to crank them in his shop while everyone thought he was busy working.

It's a big decision to choose the fraud path but someone very clever that is committed to it will fool a LOT of people. Check out Bob Lazar (not even that clever), or better yet, read my post in Community about the Kiwi (New Zealander) Con of Bangkok, Wayne Bowring. Fletcher, do you know him? I met this guy in real life and he was as phony as a $3 bill. However, he's surrounded by people that don't know it. Once he knew I was on to him he would literally hide from me, or at minimum immediately change the subject, to avoid incriminating himself any further, as I happen to be a real technologist. Things seemed suspicious pretty quick, when he made excuses for not being able to type, or claimed his eyes were acting up so he couldn't see the screen. However, even I give the benefit of the doubt for so long that it took me several months and a dozen flat out lies to finally realize what he was up to. Even then, even with hard evidence, there was no way to convince anyone else. All it takes is the ability to turn off integrity in one small part of their lives, in fact they can just turn it up in another to make up for it. (I actually told him that he is one of the most generous liars I have ever met.) He will never actually invent anything amazing but he is surrounded by people who thinks he has done it many times over and that's enough for him.

Before him I met Matthew, he led a programming team I was on in Denver and was feeding us white papers that he found on the internet but claimed they were his ideas. Unfortunately for him, the people he stole them from were wrong. That's what finally made us realize he was a fraud. It wasn't until after he was fired (cleaning his computer) that we found out where he was getting the stuff from.

Every true scientist could use an experience like that. You could say I am pessimistic, you'd probably be right.

[AB Hammer]

Reticon

Thank you for posting, that made fine reading and food for thought.

Alan

[ovyyus]

Thanks for your response, Reticon. I looked into the possibility of spring driven designs which might somehow replicate Bessler's demonstrations but was unable to get even close to the stored energy required for the job. I therefore discount springs as an energy source for his wheel unless/until something new comes to light.

I agree that there are reasons to be suspicious about Bessler even if it is difficult to tell the difference between paranoid and deceptive behaviour.

[Reticon]

thanks, I'm glad to know I'm still welcome here. I sure hope I'm wrong. Remember, my suspicion is that he was quite a clever clock maker and that he probably used dozens of these spring loaded cylinders. Perhaps he even perfected them so that he could twist them to recharge the springs? A contraption that caused the wheel to "break" when it actually ran out of energy? Though for many of the lifting demonstrations I'd still favor a theory with more human intervention.

[rlortie]

Reticon

thanks, I'm glad to know I'm still welcome here

What kind of forum would this be if we didn't have both sides to debate? It is what builds innovation and the drive to prove the opposition wrong! :-)

Ralph