Bessler's (4th) Kassel wheel Archimedes screw pump calculations

[ovyyus]

Bill, do you really thing that little return trough was catching all the water that was sploshing and splashing out of the water screw?

Did anyone stop to think about how much slippage and friction would have been present with the square pulley and rope drive system?

Jim, given the water screw turned at only 10 RPM, and the fact that it pumped only a few litres per turn, then yes I do think such a small water flow was easily controlled and returned to the tank without much spillage.

The square pulley and rope drive, and the bearings on which the water screw turned, would have been quite efficient at its low operating speed of 10 RPM. Even if water screw efficiency was as low as 50% (unlikely) then total work done, assuming your own flow rate estimate, is still only about 25 Watts.

It seems logical that if a 25 Watt load applied to the Kassel wheel slowed it down from 26 RPM to 20 RPM then 112 lbs could not be lifted directly from the axle at those speeds without some form of additional assistance (lift reduction).

[path_finder]

The first 70 MegaWatts gravity power plant:
http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/vi ... id/4852924
Is there still a small room for a Bessler wheel?

The Jim Berling (Cincinnati Ohio) design:
http://www.thegravityengine.com/uploads ... Design.pdf
Like explained in page 8 it seems to work by compression of air in a tank by the weight of another tank fullfilled with some water.
It's not really clear if the used water is returned back at the top.
The latest patent (pending):
http://www.thegravityengine.com/uploads ... Patent.pdf

[eccentrically1]

Berling claims power generation from gravity, atmospheric pressure, buoyancy, and head pressure.
I'm skeptical. Nice website, though.

[ovyyus]

Dear path_finder, what does another money making scam have to do with analysis of the Kassel wheel water screw!?

[jim_mich]

I lost my Visual Basic 6.0 Professional disc a while back. And then when I switched computers I lost the installed program. So I've wanted it again for a while now. Usually it sells for about $300 used on Ebay. I found a used copy for about $165. It should arrive in about a week. It will allow me to write a Visual Basic program to calculate the volume of each bucket on Bessler's screw pump. And it will allow me to open a bunch of VB programs that I've stored on my computer.

[jimmyjj]

Is this the same program?
http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4257071 ... ofessional

[path_finder]

Dear ovyyus,

what does another money making scam have to do with analysis of the Kassel wheel water screw!?

My post was not in relation with the screw, but with the evaluated 25W power of the wheel.
Even if we cannot forbidden any setup of gravity power plant I want anyway to still continue my quest. First because from my previous attempts I know now how to do, but also because I like the challenge. So far don't worry, we will be successful, even if the final result could have a limited torque.

[ovyyus]

My post was not in relation with the screw, but with the evaluated 25W power of the wheel.

You mean 25W power of the screw.

[jim_mich]

Is this the same program?

Yes, that looks like the same program. But it's not clear if it includes all the associated programs and help files that are on the original installation disk, which are as valuable as the main program.

[ovyyus]

Gif animation of Archimedes water screw http://math.nyu.edu/~crorres/Archimedes ... ation.html

[eccentrically1]

No consensus from these calculations?
Is there too much guesswork involved with the dimensions of the screw,etc. to give a reliable estimate? Or does it validate the output calculations on the wheel output wiki page?

[rlortie]

Question;

What is to be gained debating how much water it would lift before you find out what is doing the lifting? :-)

[eccentrically1]

We're never going to find out what is doing the lifting, so we might as well debate how much it lifted :-)

[ovyyus]

What is to be gained debating how much water it would lift before you find out what is doing the lifting? :-)

Ralph, understanding how much water is lifted relative to wheel speed decrease will give us an insight into actual wheel power.

Understanding actual wheel power might be important for those trying to replicate Bessler's demonstrations. Those trying to prove a theory might not see the relevance.

[rlortie]

Your point is taken and understood Bill, but for starters I would be happy with a self-sustaining machine that only provides enough power to overcome its own frictional elements!

If and when that is achieved, then I will push forward for exploitable power output. Whether it is like Bessler's or not remains irrelevant.

Ralph