The 'chaotical', a suggestion for the gravitic wheel?

[nicbordeaux]

You can safeley order "confit de canard" (pronounce Confee deuh Kannar) in any decent restaurant. It's pretty tastey, involves no cruelty to animals other than normally associated with rearing and slaughtering livestock for meat. It's a bit on the dry side, but if it's good quality it will be in it's own yellow juice/liquid grease. Or some prefer it with Goose grease. AFAIK Macdonalds don't do the stuff.

[silverfox]

No not McDonalds, but keep an eye on your local pizza chains...

Seems that "Duck Confit Pizza" has already created some culinary chaos in California, which usually means it's headed your way whether anyone actually likes it or not.

[path_finder]

In relation with the theory of chaos (the Lorenz wheel), see here:
http://www.cimt.plymouth.ac.uk/resource ... efault.htm
IMHO this has to do with the Orffyreus clue: is the 'chaos' the secret of Bessler wheel?

[ovyyus]

Is chaos an energy source?

[ruggerodk]

The Goose grease sounds like a tasty fuel...

[nicbordeaux]

Is chaos an energy source?

No, it is an order of energy (or lack of order, which isn't strictly true) which in the observable by human form gives the impression of total unpredictability. Actually, it is a manifestation of changes from pe to ke and vv implicating all the fictious forces engendered by movement extant in the whole of the system, and aparant in any or all of the parts of the system at any given point of time of operation. As such it is more apparant in "open" (non constrained) setups or situations, where mechanical fixed location of parts is reduced to a minimum, and muliple trajectories are available for most of the elements composing the system. The more objects, the more chaos, and as objects under the influence of ke (drive) will take the path of least resistance, a path which is constantly varying depending on the relative positions of the components to each other, precitability disapears at an increasing rate. Entropy still exists of course, and as the total amount on ke "consumed by entropy over time of operation increases, the chaos will lessen. Typically, the runtime as expressed by at least part of a system continuing to move relative to the observer will be substantially longer than that of a system comprising of ojects attached rigidly to each other, where the strain or counter forces will be dissipated into the fixed parts of the system or it's supporting device.

Nobel prize payment to be addressed to nicbordeaux. You may need an afflatus to understand it, 'coz I can't make head or tail of it on checking for mistakes. Must have had a bluidy afflatus.

[DrWhat]

Is chaotic Brownian motion a source of energy? Might be able to be used to move a hair on a flea!

[path_finder]

Dear nicbordeaux,
Many thanks for the clear explanation, possibly able to convince some members on the pertinence of this concept.
One good example is the motor inside a microwave-oven (just a vibrating coil, an inner rim with some teeth and a ratchet, everything in plastic), this is here the same concept.

Dear Ralph,
The chaos becomes an energy source with the Maxwell daemon.

In addition, in the next animation I have shown the two limit positions of the allowed excursion for a set of drums completed by a weight (in grey).
If we have a mechanism (some pins) prohibiting each drum to overpass its own vertical line, we can suppose the global COG will always be on the same side against the vertical line of the main wheel.

[nicbordeaux]

Dear path_finder, don't thank me, thank the millions of people who should be able to comprehend and express this clearly and incorporate into their builds be they blinkered physicists or PM nuts, but can't, don't or won't. Thx to these guys, the game is still open :-)

I intended to stick a "NB" addendum (whatever that means) to the above post stating something to the effect that chaos as described is just one manifestation of chaos. Chaos can in many builds lead to terminal conflict, not fluid energy flow.

In some builds, the "great conflict" can be made to occur at a desired point of operation, chanelling all the energy to one specific componet located because the system leaves it no other choice at a precise point in space relative to another part of the system, adding thus it's "concentrated energy" to the said "other part" 's energy/momentum. Shall we name this the "PM ass kick" ? For the moment I can do this with a "one shot" apparatus. If Wubbly is still around I'd love to submit vid footage and precise measurements to him, as well as Bill for Ovyyus reasons, and Fletcher.

[rlortie]

Path_finder

Dear Ralph,
The chaos becomes an energy source with the Maxwell daemon.

I do believe you have me confused with Ovyyus, I have made no comment here regarding 'Chaos'.

Ralph

[path_finder]

Dear Ralph, sorry for the misfit. I apologize.


Thinking on this concept, I tried to replace the drums by some pendula. In fact I found a very simple solution.
Hereafter an animation showing the motion of the most simplest chaotical wheel
Chaotical or centrifugal? May be the both...
The principle is simple: the four yellow rollers are in counter-rotation just for assuming the position of the red pins, where the purpose is to prohibit the pendulums to overpass the vertical line and keep the right side only (for a clockwise rotation of the wheel).
I have selected this solution (instead a ratchet in the axle of each pendulum) because in that case we must preset the position of each pendulum.
With the pin-lockers the solution is implicit and always in good position.
Note also in addition: for a self start of this uni-directional design, we need a preload of the wheel by the means of a spiral spring.
Leaving now for three weeks to Kinshasa (RD-Congo) I have no time now to build this concept.
May some member either can simulate on WM2D software, or can build a demonstrator (I'm impressed by the replicates of Mr Preston Stroud)?
I will be happy to have some confirmation of this simple wheel (even by a 'carpenter apprentice').

[daanopperman]

path_finder,

In your wheel the 4 yellow wheel's will want to rotate cw when the pendulum hit's the pin , wanting to turn the wheel ccw , but if you add one more set of wheel's between the yellow 4 and the axel that problem will disappear .The pendulums will then have a positive action on the wheel , wanting to force the wheel in a forward direction .

[path_finder]

Dear daanopperman,

In your wheel the 4 yellow wheel's will want to rotate cw when the pendulum hit's the pin

The contact at 6:00 between the pendulum and the pin must remain smooth.
Your comment is only pertinent if the bob is heavy and the length of the rod too much important. There is a precise relation with these two values and the size of the wheel, because the ratio between the pendulum period and the rotational speed of the wheel: they must be adjusted in view to get the most smooth contact. Just my opinion, this is what I will later verify thanks a building.

Another way to improve the design is to include some spiral springs inside the axles of the four pendula.

[nicbordeaux]

Indeed, it's all in the timing...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcgzDNsXepk

Not interested in debating if it's OU or black magic, a hoax, etc. Just of note, the OB weight always reaches tdc at the apex of the upswing nearest to release point on the first counterswing of pendulum arm. Unless you fudge the release point, a bit too high or to low, after all, it's eyeballed release.

And a question for anybody kind enough to help clear a tired mind (1 in the morning here) : the hub plate of the pendulum is oblong. How do you work out the loss or gain of cog on that ?

Not so important because a perfectly squre plate and hub is ready to be fitted with a perfectly linear (same thickness/weight per cm) pendulum/swing arm, and from that tests from a fixed release point can be done and the com stuff worked out beyond any possible dispute.

As shown, the device is far from complete, parts removed. As to the cat, it has 17652² lives.

[nicbordeaux]

So even though the vid was shot in low light, nobody see's what is going on ? maybe I do another vid with the relevant parts painted red in full daylight.