About Patents

[graham]

This question has probably come up before ,if it has then I apologize.

Lets say someone on the forum reveals a working design and explains how the device came into being the form it now takes.
A video of the device running and the principle behind its source of motive power.
He then declares that all the information he provides is freely available to all and sundry to use as they see fit.

Can someone else come along and obtain a patent for this device, and if they did would it be worthless since all details were freely available here in the public domain ?

Happy New Year
Graham

[jim_mich]

Anything posted on the internet becomes 'prior art' and cannot be patented by anyone.

There currently is only one exception that I'm aware of.

This one exception will soon change as the US patent law is in the process of being changed.

If you are the inventor, and if you publicly disclose your invention (that is, show it on the internet), then you can file a patent application in the USA within one year of your disclosure and still be entitled to patent. But you will loose the rights to patent in other counties which have 'first to file' patent laws. And when the USA changes the laws in a few months you will no longer be able to get a patent after public disclosure.

In all other cases, and in most other countries, and soon in the USA, the only way to get a patent is to be the first person or company to file a patent application for a new or improved invention. If the invention has been disclosed, then it is no longer 'NEW'.

In both cases (new and improved) the invention must be something that is not obvious. For instance, if the invention is contained inside a wooden wheel, then it is obvious that it could also be contained inside a metal wheel.

Any wheel that is able to self-rotate for an indefinite length of time would not be obvious, else someone somewhere would have already thought how to do it. Any such wheel would be patentable until it is publicly disclosed. Then it would no longer be patentable.

Once a method is known, then only improvements can be patented.

[Jim Williams]

I would suggest the value of the invention would remain the same whether patented or not. With free access to the invention, everyone could build one in their own backyard and everyone would save x amount on their electricty bill. But not everyone is going to build one for their own use, but instead will buy power from those who do.

The value of the combined output will be the same whether done individually or by some centralized location. The value of the invention will remain the same; the only significant difference a percentage of the return from the total output would no longer need go to the inventor.

[barksalot]

If a disclosure came first via a private forum before going to the public forums would the private forum disclosure be the date of prior art?

Mike

[jim_mich]

Hey, I'm not a patent lawyer, but I would think a private forum where only a few certain select individuals can see the invention would not be considered as prior art.

[John Collins]

I read that by emailing your invention idea to multiple parties, you may very well have “published� your invention idea before filing a patent application. In many countries around the world such release of the inventive idea may very well destroy a required “absolute novelty� for the invention.

I would have thought that posting to a restricted forum could be regarded as publishing the idea.

JC

[Ealadha]

What if the invention was invented hundreds of years ago and people just followed the instructions that were written hundreds of years ago !
What do the patent laws say about that situation ?

[Ealadha]

Also what if there is pictures of an invention on the internet . ie . the buzzsaw gravity wheel , and someone gets it to work .
What do the patant laws say about that ?

[nicbordeaux]

1 ) Nobody here or elsewhere has a "running PM wheel" which actually works.

2 ) People involved in "PM" research don't have the financial backbone to patent worldwide .

[murilo]

Nic,

2) there are international agreements where the most civilized countries are signatory.

So, this is enough for any market start covering.
Best!
M

[graham]

Thanks for all your input on this topic guys. very informative stuff especially from Jim Mich.

Graham

[murilo]

Yep... sure...
Specially if you chose someone exactly as his person... 8|
Best!
M

[Kirk]

never underestimate corruption. For example for many years the patent office did not review electronics patents. The work was contracted to RCA.
I am sure if the transistor had been developed by a garage inventor someone would have prior art. Armstrong invented the superhet circuit. He refused a million dollar offer from RCA as the patent was obviously worth much more. After years of litigation Armstrong was awarded one million dollars. Armstrong went home and committed suicide.
The knowledge of free energy would destroy the empires of Rockefeller and ilk. Do you seriously think they would allow that? I truly believe the knowledge has to be disseminated in hours to so many people it cannot be contained else the inventor will have an "accident". If they contain this it will be buried until they have no oil to sell.

[graham]

You're right Kirk, this would be one invention that would really harm some very powerful interests . It would upset the political balance of the entire world and wipe out the wealth of those who profit from the status quo !!

So the only way to go, is public disclosure on a grand scale . This should keep you safe from harm and avoid the new knowledge from being suppressed

You would be a hero in the eyes of he common man and could look in the mirror and say "WELL DONE" .

Will it happen ????

Graham

[path_finder]

Once again, the fantastic story of a promising invention, where another face of DSK is revealed:
How Mr Joseph FERRAYE, inventor and official patent owner of a device allowing the extinction of the fired oil wells, has been shortcuted by the MIB:
http://www.2477news.com/Assignation-dev ... _a778.html
In french. A poor automatic translation is available hereafter.
Very instructive for those willing a patent for a gravity wheel.
When the amount of money is too much high (in the Ferraye case the incredible sum of : 8.419.987.200 US$) there is only one way: go back home and sleep.