What should someone do with a solution?

[Jim Williams]

Ralph:

wheelbarrow patents


class 280 - land vehicles / subclass 47.31 - with receptacle body (e.g., wheelbarrow):
This subclass is indented under subclass 47.3. Vehicles providing a receptacle body. (1) Note. Most of the vehicles in this subclass are wheelbarrows.
(2) Note. A golf bag attached to a vehicle is considered a receptacle body.


http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Pars ... RCL&d=pall

ovyyus

Nothing would gather more attention than the Patent Office leaking it had Bessler's wheel, although I agree with you.

[Andyb]

Hmmm,many people believe China and the east are the new economies to work with,it has also been pointed out to me that china respects it own patents but not other peoples /countries,it is my belief that china may need it the most due to its own environmental impact and they have the potential to get as many made as possible.Ken you have to at least gain your own freedom from dept etc unless your sorted of course already .Like people have said already what about you receiving the acknowledgement , you certainly deserve it, so think very carefully before you do anything, all the best Andy.

[jim_mich]

There are reasons for patenting a Bessler wheel.

Suppose you were fortunate to discover a mechanism that produces perpetual rotation, what then?

If you display the mechanism on the internet, then others can copy and build it. But as far as patenting it, none would be able to patent a device built as shown by your disclosure.

Most anyone could 'design around' your disclosed design and get patents on each and every 'improvement' or separate design. This would limit the 'free use' to only your original design. If that original design was not the ultimate best design possible, then you have limited mankind to freely using only your initial inferior design. Others will be building superior designs that they have patented. This is/was not you original intent when you 'gave away' the idea on the internet.

The better route to travel is to get a patent on the method or principle that produces perpetual motion. I doubt that there is more than one principle. This would cover all wheels that work on the principle, regardless of how they are designed. This puts you in the driver’s seat. People can still patent individual designs, but they cannot build wheel without infringing the original patent. So you make a deal with each improvement. You agree to allow them to make their improved Bessler wheel only if they allow other people/manufacturers to build their improved designs. You charge each builder/user a very small licensing fee per wheel, much like licensing an automobile. I'm sure the governments of the world would soon be taxing the wheel, just like they did to Bessler. But the bottom line is you would prevent any one corporation from controlling the wheel. You can then give away the patent rights or you can use the income to build and give away wheels.

As far as patents being costly, a patent cost about as much as a new 'high end' automobile.

,it has also been pointed out to me that china respects it own patents but not other peoples /countries,

Each country has its own patent laws. You would need to obtain a Chinese patent for it to be valid in China. An American patent protects only the USA. It would prevent China from making, using, or selling their wheels in the USA. Likewise a Chinese patent would prevent anyone from making, using, or selling a wheel in China. And in most countries the patent owner must enforce their own patent rights by taking infringer's to court.

[rlortie]

First it was the PTO in their instruction manual that used the wheelbarrow as an example of an UN-patentable item. Apparently they and I stand to be corrected and I need to get my facts together

Three of your 50 patents are identified as wheelbarrows which all claim prior art. The remaining 47 deal with varied designs and augmentations based on prior art.

As for the basic wheelbarrow it has been around since:

The wheelbarrow may have existed in ancient Greece in the form of a one-wheel cart.[1] Two building material inventories for 408/407 and 407/406 B.C. from the temple of Eleusis list, among other machines and tools, "1 body for a one-wheeler (hyperteria monokyklou)"[2] (ὑπερτηρία μονοκύκλου in Greek):

China dates the wheelbarrow in 118 AD

I apologize for my mislead ignorance and rest assured one can patent a different designed wheelbarrow based on prior art. which puts it in the same category as the Frigidaire refrigerator patent.

Ralph

[Jim Williams]

You should see the patents on the wheel; there's too many classes/subclasses alone, much less numbers of patents, to list them all.

I don't see what's wrong applying for a patent on day one; then releasing it to the world over the internet on day two. Would that interfere with the patent being granted? Where does one obtain a list of people to whom to email it?

[jim_mich]

There are a few different ways to release the wheel to the world. Releasing it on day two can cause problems if the initial patent isn't written very accurately so that no revisions are needed for it to issue.

As far as a list of who to email it to, if it actually works, then people will be emailing you.

I would figure out how to build a small table-top proof of principle wheel that is able to keep turning with a very small friction load. The goal would be less than $10 each for materials and minimal labor time, say an hour to build each one. Make as many as you can afford and according to time available. Collect the addresses of a number of people, such as university professors and trusted forum members, then ship a wheel to each one. At the same time post full plans for the wheel on Besslerwheel.com and other overunity web sites. Make a video and post it on Youtube. The main hurdle is making people understand that the concept really works. Only hands-on working models will be acceptable to most people.

[Jim Williams]

For $25 get yourself a consultation with a patent attorney and watch him go "pro bono" the instant he sees a working model and suddenly out of nowhere, there is money for all the patent fees.

Perhaps wait until the Patent Office informs you the patent will be granted and then release it over the internet, just to be sure.

[jim_mich]

There is always the possibility of a secrecy order being placed on the patent application, which is simply the government deciding that they will steal your idea and give you nothing in return, claiming it is for national security. Then you are out of options. It is better to at least place the concept out in the open before the powers-that-be declare it a secret. If a patent issues then fine. If a secrecy order is issued, then the world will still know how it works, and the secrecy gag order will have no effect. Thus the initial patent application MUST be very well written such that almost no changes need to be made in order for it to issue. Energy related patents can be accelerated to issue sooner. One must have all his ducks lined up in a row before hand. Of course the patent office will demand to see a working model. By that time there should already be many working models and replication by others proving that it works and preventing any secrecy gag orders.

The goal is to control the situation enough so that others never control you or the wheel. Only when you fully own it can you freely give it away, if that be your desire.

[Jim Williams]

Good point about a secrecy order. I note North Koreans, Libyans and Cubans are routinely granted American patents. Perhaps if any of these people develop a working wheel, it would be better for them to apply for patents in their own countries or China; although I'm not so sure how an American secrecy order could be placed on them regardless.

[rlortie]

I agree with Jim_Mich and his plan of attack on the PTO by having the invention already in public awareness. I have also been told that when a patent is ready for sending via US mail, you send it certified, receipt requested. As soon as the postmaster ( an employee of the US government) stamps it postpaid, you are now in the Patent Pending stage.

If am wrong, I hope there is some one who can set me straight.

Ralph

[Jim Williams]

I suspect unless the government discovers developing a fuctioning wheel would require a Manhattan Project level effort to realize it, they won't attempt a secrecy order for fear of the US cutting off its nose despite its face. Then again, it's the government.

[jim_mich]

PTO's Rule 10(37 CFR 1.10) states, in effect, that mailing any paper to the PTO by Express Mail, with the EM number on the transmittal letter, is the same as physically delivering the paper directly to the PTO. Thus you can consider and call your application 'Patent Pending' as soon as the postal clerk hands you the EM receipt, provided all the papers of the application are present and are properly completed. You need to buy the Express Mail postage, which will have an EM number, then add the EM number to the transmittal letter, place all paperwork in your envelope, seal it, either you or the postal worker will affix the EM postal sticker to the envelope, then as you hand it to the postal clerk to be mailed, your patent is pending.

You should not send the application by registered mail, certified mail, or private courier (FedEx, etc.)

All this is explained in the book "Patent It Yourself" by patent attorney David Pressman, published by Nolo Press. My 10th edition copy is now almost 9 years old. Time for me to buy a newer edition, since a lot has changed and continues to change. I know that most patents are now filed using the internet by most patent attorneys. I assume they get an instant filing number as soon as all the pages have been transmitted.

[ovyyus]

The goal is to control the situation enough so that others never control you or the wheel. Only when you fully own it can you freely give it away, if that be your desire.

Sounds like a great idea but reality is never so simple.

If the inventor does not have thousands of dollars to invest in the patent process then he will have to find a partner. Control gone.

Even if an inventor manages to retain control during the patent process, he will still need help/partners upon disclosure in order to bankroll never ending legal challenges from corporate sharks and wolves. Control gone.

An inventor might easily control a 'normal' invention. But he has no chance of retaining individual control and ownership of an invention that might impact on national security and/or global economics. Dream on.

[daxwc]

An inventor might easily control a 'normal' invention. But he has no chance of retaining individual control and ownership of an invention that might impact on national security and/or global economics. Dream on.

Wise words Bill as usual, but they would rather dream; besides that why worry about it till you have a working prototype, you might need the grey matter for that.

[rlortie]

I suspect unless the government discovers developing a fuctioning wheel would require a Manhattan Project level effort to realize it, they won't attempt a secrecy order for fear of the US cutting off its nose despite its face. Then again, it's the government.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/stor ... d=89127786
http://alexwellerstein.com/atomic_patents/
http://www.cccoe.k12.ca.us/abomb/popups/patent.htm
http://www.cccoe.k12.ca.us/abomb/timeline.htm
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/08/03/29/ ... tomic-bomb
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Usa/Med/index.html
http://patentlibrarian.blogspot.com/200 ... -bomb.html

And now for a little humor on the atomic side;
http://boingboing.net/2011/06/13/atom-b ... val-s.html

Its movie time! get your popcorn.
http://video.pbs.org/video/1913278741/