BUOYANCY

[rasselasss]

An example of Mahn's(see link),i don't know where it resides but i can see the other side of his argument ,if his workload as master cakemaker had'nt hindered him he might have achieved his goal.

[rasselasss]

http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.a ... 95854.aspx

[Dwylbtzle]

Dwylbzle,only you would say something as you see it(no bad thing) i had a good laugh at the comparison.....Freemasonry has no secrets today but in those years it was closely guarded as J.C. hinted he could have been a refused member although i think unlikely Prince Karl being a member of the higher orders.In many portraits and photos over the years since its formation i can recognise the square formed by an arm,compasses,the numbers 3,5,or 7 innocently included by pieces of paper,books etc.the placing of fingers in a two and a half gesture,skull, coiled rope ,to name a few.If he was having a" pop"at Freemasonry at a time when it taken very seriously it could explain his demise.(or not)....I am in no way a critic of Freemasonry having been a member for 40 years,since its formation its charitable contribution is unequaled by any Govt.or organisation,which to me says a lot......Good Luck.

if by "J.C." you mean THE LORD Jesus Christ
I happen to know exactly what you are talking about--but he wasn't refering to "the freemasons" as I doubt they existed at that point
He said "The stone which was rejected by the builders has now become chief over all the corners"
that was refering to Himself being rejected by the Jews
and He was also refering to the capstone to The Great Pyramid--He is called THE CHIEF CORNERSTONE
and the capstone is missing from the pyramid supposedly because the builders thought there was something wrong with it and rejected it and never put it in place
and a pyramid is the only building with FIVE cornerstones
there's one each at the corners of the square base--and one at the peak which is over all the other corners
so a pyramid is the only kinda building with a CHIEF cornerstone
because any of the four cornerstones of a regular square building would have nothing distinguishing it from the other three

the great pyramid ( as isaiah explained ) is the "altar in the midst of egypt"
and the "pillar at the border thereof"
because it's at the border of upper and lower egypt--and, once those two were united as one nation, that also puts it smack dab in the middle of egypt

Isaiah 19:19-25 (King James Version)

19In that day shall there be an altar to the LORD in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar at the border thereof to the LORD.

20And it shall be for a sign and for a witness unto the LORD of hosts in the land of Egypt: for they shall cry unto the LORD because of the oppressors, and he shall send them a saviour, and a great one, and he shall deliver them.

21And the LORD shall be known to Egypt, and the Egyptians shall know the LORD in that day,



here ya go:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/26119658/Geom ... s-Creation
i noticed all this stuff back in the early seventies, when i was a teenager--but i couldn't get many people to listen or understand or believe me
and now it's all over the internet if you look
seek and ye shall find i guess
pretty good advice

[ovyyus]

In that day shall there be an altar to the LORD in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar at the border thereof to the LORD.

Osiris is still lord for some.

[Dwylbtzle]

jackie onasis?--yeah, she's still a babe
i'd do her

of course--talking about all this believing and proving, and stuff: "they have moses and the prophets...if they won't believe moses and the prophets they won't believe though even a man should rise from the dead"

[jim_mich]

if by "J.C." you mean THE LORD Jesus Christ

No, in this case J.C. means John Collins.

I happen to know exactly what you are talking about--but he wasn't refering to "the freemasons" as I doubt they existed at that point
He said "The stone which was rejected by the builders has now become chief over all the corners"

Dwylbtzle, you seem to be talking about Jesus 2000 years ago, while everyone else is talking about Bessler and Karl about 300 years ago. So it's very obvious that you don't know exactly what is being talked about.

[Dwylbtzle]

well, i told y'all i didn't
that cryptic masonry stuff was pretty highly engraved
lending to tangents
i thought there was a reference to things the masons possibly discuss a lot
but they're secret
so i'm not claiming to know for sure WHAT they discuss
my bad

i guess some people say the freemasons do indeed go all the way back to jc's time
no reason why not, i guess
anyway, i blame looking at that obama skull
that thing's pretty harsh

[rasselasss]

What i've been attemping to do here is to add "flesh"so to speak and try to understand the jealousy / conflict involved on both sides,a line of thought open to debate.....A Freemason in those days had to be "freeborn",no servants,labourers etc. were admissable only those skilled could join the lower orders a class system for your position in life,the highest orders occupied by princes,crowns of europe etc.and others inbetween....As can be seen in portraits of that era the bigger the wig the more important the person you were,hence the expression "big wigs"still used today.....Newton,Wagner,and i'm sure his many critics would have been Freemasons which could explain Bessler's portrait without his wig and add credence to him not being a member.....i have a secret too, bigger than any of yours(the lack of wig wearing a ref.to his lower class but his superiority over big wigs)......we recognise his critics were intelligent,and as J.C.has pointed out pentograms ,symbols etc.in his portraits which they would have recognised instantly...this is all conjecture but nonetheless worthy of thought........Just to add Dwy.the link earlier if you navigate gives you the history,etc.of Freemasonry ....there are no secrets today all can be found in the link and open to anyone on the W.W.W......Good Luck.

[Dwylbtzle]

good because puzzles give me a headache
skulls and shit creep me out
and i can't keep a damn secret any way

[Dwylbtzle]

.....A Freemason in those days had to be "freeborn",no servants,labourers etc..

"I am a bard. I am he who peeps forth from the unhewn dolmen arch. I will not divulge secrets to slaves"
-Taliesyn

but you could be a churl
a churl is the lowest class of freemen

so, rassleasss, laddie, are you Scottish Rite? (or one of them bog dwelling, toad suckin' Yorkies?)
-(just kidding)

[rasselasss]

I found this free e-book when searching for mahn , spool down the page mentions Orffyreus,mahn,wagner i don't read or speak German but could be of interest to those that do...there seems to be a lot on p.m.in other pages ...possibly some-one would enlighten with a brief on it.

[rasselasss]

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=4ghC ... hn&f=false

[rasselasss]

In Ramananda's account(orffye tripod.com) of "The dialogues at the castle of weisenstein"with Bessler,Count Karl,Gravesande and Baron Fischer in 1721,Count Karl asks Bessler,"how many wheels have you built"he replied ...Five and the First wheel i built is still working in my village ,drawing water and irrigating fields but the others i destroyed etc......by my reckoning it was installed 1711,ten years earlier.......the question is,where was his village(we know which town he was born near)) ....if we knew this,church records of his Baptism and civil also census records which are available on line would give a possible locality(if you can read German)of this wheel ...just a thought really for those interested.

[rasselasss]

I should have included..... if the above account is true,and Bessler's first wheel was running for up to 10 years,many others would have "seen"the innards,(human nature and curiosity being what it is)... assuming it was the same design as the Weisenstein Wheel and after having declared this to those present Fischer etc.,they would only have to search and find what they wished for free......

[Dwylbtzle]

yes, if bessler set up a wheel, anywhere
and then just went off, bilthely happy in the knowledge that it was back
there, on the ol' homestead south forty, watering the crops
that would mean he had completely given up any notion of ever worrying
about keeping it a secret
even a chimpanzee could and would make a cro-bar out of a stick or something,
and pry in and take a peek

that sure sounds suspicious