A very strange gravitic motor

[agor95]

I wounder if Bessler looked into using the precession of a gyroscope caused by the turning annular momentum of it falling to annular momentum around the horizontal has a power source to keep the annular momentum going in the main flywheel?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Gyros ... ession.gif

[Grimer]

Did they have gyros then?

[rlortie]

The earliest known gyroscope was made by German Johann Bohnenberger, who first wrote about it in 1817.

[Grimer]

The earliest known gyroscope was made by German Johann Bohnenberger, who first wrote about it in 1817.

Thanks for the info, Ralph.

Since Bessler died in 1745 he can't have known about the gyro unless he had secretly developed his own and kept it under oilskin wraps.

[Grimer]

I should add that I think Agor's question was very pertinent since I feel sure a hierarchy of rotations are involved. The gyro is the best known of such a hierarchy.

Edit 1: Perhaps I should say a hierarchy of closed paths which are not necessarily circular.

Edit 2: I can see how the Keenie Wheel can be viewed as three mutually closed paths at near right angles to each other. Not exactly right angles of course because if they were they wouldn't be able to transfer motion from one scale to another. The planimeter familiar to all surveyors for measuring irregular areas is a good example of that kind of high angle interaction I remember from my student days. Sailing at near right angles to the wind is another example but firing prune stones across the dinner hall by squeezing them between finger and thumb is the best of all.

[agor95]

Thanks Ralph for the first recorded gyroscope date.

When looking at this notion I came to the idea that a top/rattle [MT-141] as engraved by Bessler with its high center of gravity would generate a greater turning annular momentum as it tried to fall.

The problem is reducing the top/rattles rotation to as low as possible.
At the same time what is the [want of a better word] stalling rotation rate?

We know as the rotation rate reduces the procession rate increases.

Also what factors cause annular momentum magnitude?

There is IMHO a reason why MT-141 looks like a rattle.

Regards

[path_finder]

As indicated above in this thread the first gyroscope has been invented later than Bessler's life time..
But what is really behind this word?
Can we consider as 'gyroscope' any compact object rotating on it's axis?
If yes Bessler could have well used a gyroscopic effect in one of his designs. How?...

..May I suggest how he did?!
On the MT138 we were almost focused on the first couple of workers (with the hammers).
Since a long time I was asking myself for what purpose this toy has been doubled and what can be the significance of this second couple of characters.
A detail of the MT138 is fundamental, as you can see on the excellent site here:
http://www.orffyre.com/mt121-143.html, (many thanks for Bill McMurphy)
the body of the both workers is TWISTED like the UTP-5E network cable.
This could be an important clue, not very studied until now.
Just take a dice per example.
Drill an hole across two opposite faces.
Pass through an iron rod.
Drill an hole at each end of the rod.
Pass a small rope in each two holes.
Hold on the ends of the ropes (two ends in each hand).
And now pull and push alternatively
You will observe the alternative rotation of the dice+rod and in the same time the twist of the ropes on the both sides.

If this is easy to do manually, the question is wich mechanism is able to do this job?
saying the particular following rule:
- untie the twisted ropes during the half of the rotation
- twist the untied ropes during the second half (BTW reversing the rotation of the weights)
This mechanism exists. It's a part of my ancient post (eliminate the weights and keep only the frame) here:
http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/download.php?id=6381
The yellow arms angles increase and decrease twice for each rotation.
Put the end of the ropes at the end of these yellow arms.

This is related with another question I put earlier on this forum, without any definitive answer: the exact orientation of the Bessler cylindrical weights.
Hereafter I give here again this drawing. The above suggested design is using the second way (red) below.

[Grimer]

Interesting post. Twist comes into the folded Vesica and the Keenie as well.

Compliments on spotting the twisted men.

[wheelrite]

http://portrait.kaar.at/Musikgeschichte ... alther.jpg this johann?
Regards
Jon

[rlortie]

Jon,

I believe that most who have researched this will tell you that Gottfried only had Gottfried Bessler as a given name. He is usually referred to as 'Gottfried' the brother of Johann.

[LustInBlack]

Path, same augmented problem, different method.. But it looks nice! 8]