Thx Machine II

[thx4]

Just a technical question before I show you some photos of my new project;

I have a speed controller, and on my working scale, the wheel will never exceed 1 meter in diameter in my workshop. I've noticed that at 50/60 RPM, nothing falls off...everything sticks to the periphery, which means, in my opinion, that any wheel that's unbalanced at this speed and in this format is a decoy.

As the wheel increases RPM, centrifugal force acting on free to move radial weights increases. When CF acting on free to move radial weights reaches a magnitude equal to the force of gravity, the weights become pinned at the rim. Bessler's operating wheel speeds and sizes (CF greater than G) therefore suggest that he did not use free to move radial weights.

J’adore ces discussions au moins on avance, je fais partie des BESSLERIENS que RIEN n’arrête 😊

Pour revenir au sujet, ce matin après mon shoot cérébral de café noir, voilà ce que me suggère mon « GPT» intérieur »
@ Ovyus, B a pris un autre chemin, une grande roue relativement légère, pour être lancée manuellement, couplé par différentiel (engrenage) à un système central (proche de l’axe) déséquilibré très très lourd et très très lent…
Donc beaucoup plus facile à mettre en œuvre lol.
Le fait que le system soit très lent offre des perspectives intéressantes.
J’ai déjà quelques idées… 😊

I love these discussions, at least we're making progress, I'm one of those BESSLERIANS that NOTHING stops 😊

Getting back on topic, this morning after my cerebral shot of black coffee, here's what my inner "GPT" suggests to me "
@ Ovyus, B took a different route, a relatively light large wheel, to be launched manually, coupled by differential (gear) to a very very heavy and very very slow unbalanced central system (close to the axis)....
So much easier to implement lol.
The fact that the system is very slow offers some interesting perspectives.
I've already got a few ideas... 😊

[thx4]

A short video to illustrate my point.
https://youtu.be/mKNPD5eqSgM
https://youtu.be/ybuLJGfyK18

[ovyyus]

Thx4, the first video seems to show a heavy pre-unbalanced drum trying to roll across the table but it is being slowed down by a hammer that is made to oscillate against it until the unbalanced drum slowly rolls into equilibrium and everything stops.

[Robinhood46]

Bessler said that the weights work in pairs.
If two opposing weights are interconnected, the CF will be in opposing directions, which will be cancelling out each other. The difference between the two forces, because of their different distances from the central pivot, will be the determining factor as to what speed the wheel can rotate before CF holds the furthest of the two against the rim. This is if the weights are of equal mass.
If the weights are of different masses, but still interconnected, the difference between the CF will still be the determining factor as to when everything blocks.

[johannesbender]

There aren't anyone here claiming they have a working wheel that i know about , however i don't really care if there is anyone who claims to have a working wheel too...

Exactly. We all know how this subject is treated outside the forum. Allowing constant hen-pecking to roost inside the forum will have a chilling effect on discussion. I guess that's the intent.

I would rather see free discussion that might be wrong than no discussion because incessant banal objections by some WHONG agent with an agenda it trying to shut it all down.

Why i don't care about most claims is , none of them i have ever seen had/have anything on Bessler , the tests , the different wheels build , a large amount of the witnesses weren't just your average people , the testimonies , etc etc nothing and no-one has ever come close to any of it , so to me there is only one claim of interest.

[JUBAT]

I'm not trying to shut it all down...in fact look how its intended purpose has sparked renewed vigor and interest!

So you have different posters on a regular basis. You have JL preaching about Nazis, Norwegian Heritage, AB Hammer and Ralph Lortie, who never post any more.

You have WC claiming a runner in a sim with the occasional rough speech involving bromance and kid diddling (a JL thread)...

You've got Fletch with his dead on accurate scientific evaluations.

Then you have these others who keep claiming success or claiming almost there with a frustratingly consistent chain of justified recants and evidently it's okay because they are trying.

Finally, you've got me saying it can't be done in my lifetime, exposing the people who claim success but never prove it, and even still throwing out the occasional supportive idea.

Personally I think the Nazi talk and false claims are the 2 most cancerous things to contend with. JL gets routinely banned so fair enough.

But if you guys like, I can change my tune to a more positive one riddled with posts of false hopes and saying things like, I've got a runner...only to say the next day...oh wait it stopped in the night...well certainly success is just days away! We can ride that hope of a working wheel train right over the edge of the cliff.

There are some seriously smart people in here, but if man is so smart, why in this modern era has it not been solved? It's just weights in a wheel after all. Might there be a small chance its just a cleverly written story meant to distract people?

If everyone is so blooming serious about it, then why aren't you paying head to WC' s coments about making your own gravity and Bessler's biggest clue about the weights gaining force from swinging?

If you shift 2 pendulums side to side with one up and one down...it acts like 2 sails pulling the wheel along. You need more than 2 pendulums to sustain rotation. Get enough of them swinging, latched, and released at the right time and you'll probably get movement. I still have strong reservations about pendulums, but kudos to those who have stuck with them. I guess Besslers swinging weights clue condemns us all to pendulum use and I'm forced to eat my own personal crow in this regard.

Instead, you want to persist in relying on natural gravity to make the wheel work, and you will not find success that way no matter how hard you try.

I want to be wrong, but until a real wheel is invented I'm right.

[Robinhood46]

I want to be wrong, but until a real wheel is invented I'm right.

Flat earthers were not right, up until someone pointed out that the earth wasn't flat, they were wrong all the time.
How can you criticise people for convincing themselves of having a runner without actually having a runner, if you convince yourself that Bessler was a fraud without actually having a wheel that does exactly what Bessler's did, as a fraud?
What is the difference between, we know Bessler's wheel works but we don't know how he did it and we know Bessler was a fraud but we don't know how he did it?
Maybe you could focus on proving yourself to be right, by creating a wheel that can do the same tasks as Bessler's and pass the same scrutiny. I for one would be very pleased to actually have some proof that it was possible that Bessler was a fraud, because at present it is just an assumption.

[thx4]

Will we continually cycle between the ups and downs of this pursuit ? - probably .. then we'll moan and groan that it was solved and what will I exercise my brain with now - lol ..

I always have a plan B lol
I'm interested in two impossible areas, horse racing and Bessler, when it doesn't want to work (racing) it hurts a lot more than Bessler when it doesn't. 😊
I'm a masochist.

[agor95]

Try spending thousands of dollars and your whole life building this thing and having none of it come to fruition - a total waste of life, time, and money - and then see how you feel.

I would feel stupid that I did not learn how to validate the designs first.

That my friend is why I study; so I am not stupid and do not feel have a wasted a lifetime and money.

Just ask why you are here? I hope it is to explore the unknown.

Or to bitch about the known?

Cheer Up and explore cheaply

[JUBAT]

I used to be here because I was hoping to glean some information. It seems about all I learned was how to claim success and then recant as well as how to waste time and money.

Out of everything I've read, the most important thing has been WC's comment about creating gravity. That's it because you can't rely on natural gravity to create this movement. By creating gravity, you can control it and direct it to where it's needed.

Mark my words, if there is any truth to all of this nonsense, it will involve pendulums, springs, and triggers.

[johannesbender]

I'm not trying to shut it all down...in fact look how its intended purpose has sparked renewed vigor and interest!

So you have different posters on a regular basis. You have JL preaching about Nazis, Norwegian Heritage, AB Hammer and Ralph Lortie, who never post any more.

You have WC claiming a runner in a sim with the occasional rough speech involving bromance and kid diddling (a JL thread)...

You've got Fletch with his dead on accurate scientific evaluations.

Then you have these others who keep claiming success or claiming almost there with a frustratingly consistent chain of justified recants and evidently it's okay because they are trying.

Finally, you've got me saying it can't be done in my lifetime, exposing the people who claim success but never prove it, and even still throwing out the occasional supportive idea.

Personally I think the Nazi talk and false claims are the 2 most cancerous things to contend with. JL gets routinely banned so fair enough.

But if you guys like, I can change my tune to a more positive one riddled with posts of false hopes and saying things like, I've got a runner...only to say the next day...oh wait it stopped in the night...well certainly success is just days away! We can ride that hope of a working wheel train right over the edge of the cliff.

There are some seriously smart people in here, but if man is so smart, why in this modern era has it not been solved? It's just weights in a wheel after all. Might there be a small chance its just a cleverly written story meant to distract people?

If everyone is so blooming serious about it, then why aren't you paying head to WC' s coments about making your own gravity and Bessler's biggest clue about the weights gaining force from swinging?

If you shift 2 pendulums side to side with one up and one down...it acts like 2 sails pulling the wheel along. You need more than 2 pendulums to sustain rotation. Get enough of them swinging, latched, and released at the right time and you'll probably get movement. I still have strong reservations about pendulums, but kudos to those who have stuck with them. I guess Besslers swinging weights clue condemns us all to pendulum use and I'm forced to eat my own personal crow in this regard.

Instead, you want to persist in relying on natural gravity to make the wheel work, and you will not find success that way no matter how hard you try.

I want to be wrong, but until a real wheel is invented I'm right.

Absence of evidence is not evidence itself , however i have learned through the years you cant convince anyone of anything except when it is what they want to or already believe.

Everyone does as they feel is right , no blame or worries from my side , i do what i feel is right , i have always been a realist when it comes to this , i haven't build a single wheel in my whole life ,because i know when something is impossible or has absolutely no chance in hell .

I evaluate things to a point i can determine according to the laws and such whether its worth my time or not , i do however build and test the little things i find should be possible to see if it really is as i think .

Sometimes there are things i look in to that i would not know what would happen , and surprisingly enough there are also plenty of things that are possible that i find much more attractive options than impossible things which i try to avoid.

Wasting money and time all depends on how you choose to approach this , everyone to his own though , i don't like talking about matters not directly Bessler or "wheel" related , it tends to bring discussions down to a personal level which i dislike.

[ovyyus]

Bessler's biggest clue about the weights gaining force from swinging?

It's dumb to build fantasy notions upon a wrong translation/interpretation. It's even dumber to then suppose you can advise others :D

[JUBAT]

I lo e being dumb then. If you know the answer, show us. You know...being Im dumb and all.

[ovyyus]

I lo e being dumb then. If you know the answer, show us. You know...being Im dumb and all.

It's not my fault you wasted your life swinging that WHONG around when you could have been educating yourself.

[JUBAT]

Lol well I'll just kick back and watch all these attempts. It's fixing to be a good show.