Big Troubles Brewing For The Theoretical Physics Smart-Set!!!

[agor95]

@WaltzCeee

I take it the conversation has move away from the 'The Dominant Flywheel' here.

The best suggestion is a simple computer model of the strain torque when the cam connects to the spring or a pendulum lever alternative.

The original youtube video is not important. The forum proving the effect is more relevant.

Is your description related to the 'Flippin' Flywheel' thread?

[Furcurequs]

This isn't a magnetic motor. It is simpler than that.

Grimer, are you sure about that? It looks like it could be an electromagnetic motor to me.

It seems to me that you have ignored my arguments as to why it could work.

To be honest, I've been trying to ignore them!

Why don't you address them.

It could lead to me becoming upset again! ...lol

Is the calculus involved in the third derivative of position with respect to time too much for you?

Probably not, though for a really complex equation I might have to pull out an old calculus book or something.

When I was a kid I heard tell of a drivers' education teacher who would balance a tennis ball or golf ball or something like that on a pedestal on the dashboard of the drivers' ed car. He would then tell the student drivers to drive in such a manner that the ball didn't fall off of the pedestal - since of course new drivers tend to be a bit "jerky" in their driving.

Trying to keep that ball balanced, then, helped them to not do what new drivers tended to do - and things such as slamming on the brakes, flooring the accelerator or making too sudden of a turn.

So, quite obviously, there are times that we might want to limit the magnitude of that third derivative of position with respect to time - the rate of change of the acceleration. Jerky motion can even lead to "energy loss" in mechanical devices.

If you have a powerful engine and you floor the accelerator of your car, for example, that sudden change in acceleration of the drive train can cause wheels to lose traction with the road, and then the spinning of your wheels and the burning of the rubber isn't really transferring the available energy to where it is that you really want it to go.

For instance: is the rotating cam effectively a rotating pendulum or not?

Well, without considering the spring pressing against the cam, the addition of the cam on the shaft might give you a slightly out-of-balance wheel mechanism that could behave a bit like a pendulum, I suppose, giving a pendulous oscillation when it doesn't have enough kinetic energy to make it through a full rotation. Of course with enough kinetic energy, there would then be a pulsating rotation - a bit like you might have if you tried to spin a pendulum like a wheel.

When stationary, will it keel or not?

It probably will.

Ignore bearing friction, we are talking principles.

Yes or no - and if no, why.

Already answered. Probably yes.

If it's not a fake, and you're libelling of the builder by implication is unjustified, then you are in danger of throwing away a pearl of great price.

If this was such a valuable pearl, why did the fellow broadcast it to a bunch of youtube watching swine?! ;)

13:45. Again the kingdom of heaven is like to a merchant seeking good pearls.

I don't see that the sorts of pearls that I'm looking for are available from others, so I'm having to do my own pearl diving and oyster shucking.

13:46. Who when he had found one pearl of great price, went his way, and sold all that he had, and bought it.

I'm not sure if the thing you are talking about is even a pearl at all. It looks more like some sort of fake plastic bead to me! ...so to speak.

Elsewhere you claim,

Anyway, maybe due to my choices ... I actually do now have some interesting things I could share with the world of not just a technical nature but seemingly also of historical and "religious" ones, too.

I hope they include assuming people are innocent of fraud, a sin against the 8th commandment, until proved guilty beyond all reasonable doubt.

What if it includes seeing that the world is currently in the situation that the Bible said it would be in? ...and that lots of people are really really ignorant.

2477 Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury.
278 He becomes guilty: of rash judgment who, even tacitly, assumes as true, without sufficient foundation, the moral fault of a neighbor;

I've been in environments where people teasing, taunting, pranking and hoaxing each other was just the norm - where intelligent and/or (at least) playful people would try to get each other's goat.

When the fellow in the video says he's not "allowed" to tell you the brand name of the epoxy he's using, for instance, what does that tell you? Well, it is just one of the things that tell me that he's being silly and that it's all just a joke.

So, how would you test the "spirit" of such a prophet of perpetual motion?

I tell you that I have the eyes to see the spirit of a prankster! ...and to see the reaction of those who would fall for a deception.

[nicbordeaux]

Edit :

Apparently, boiled potatoes make for better batteries:
.

This is stuff too dangerous to discuss : can you imagine what would happen if a meltdown occurred in a boiled potato reactor ?

[WaltzCee]

@WaltzCeee

I take it the conversation has move away from the 'The Dominant Flywheel' here.

You take it correctly. We're talking potatoes now.

[Furcurequs]

Edit :

Apparently, boiled potatoes make for better batteries:
.

This is stuff too dangerous to discuss : can you imagine what would happen if a meltdown occurred in a boiled potato reactor ?

I hope it wouldn't be as bad as the oil fire I had on my stove last week after frying my potatoes! ...lol

I was trying to boil a pot of water, actually, but I mistakenly turned the wrong stove eye onto high, and unfortunately the one with the canola oil covered frying pan still sitting on it!

Luckily, I had the presence of mind... ...well, eventually... ...to think to put the flaming frying pan into the oven to smother the huge flames.

[Grimer]

Apparently, boiled potatoes make for better batteries:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/innovatio ... 180948260/

http://www.bbc.com/future/story/2013111 ... -the-world

I'm having a hard time finding specific numbers for energy output, but they say the output from a boiled potato hooked up the way they've done it is equivalent to about 1/2 a regular AA battery and for the same energy output should be about 1/50th the cost.

Oh, look... I've even found a video demonstrating that the output of a boiled potato exceeds that of a raw one.

...and, would you believe it?!

It seems to have been made by the same guy who hoaxed the V-gate!!

"Potato Battery energy version"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ko_R3PeadG4

I might have to actually do this experiment myself.

LOL. Well between the lot of you, you've certainly made this thread lively. That is what a forum's for, eh. Lively discussions, without coming to blows -unlike those parliaments of people who have the misfortune of not being being born an Englishman. ;-)

So thanks for all your contributions.

I'll start my replies first with the rather interesting digression of the potato battery.

As a boy my natural curiosity led me to break open batteries to see what was inside. What did I find. A gluey mess. And if you break open a parboiled potato what does one find, a gluey mess - but any normal potato gives us a lot more gluey mess than is found in an AA battery.

On the face of it then, if a potato battery works at all I see no reason why a bigger one will not have more capacity than a smaller one. After all bigger Duracell batteries have greater capacities than smaller Duracell batteries don't they.

Isn't the mushy potato simply acting as a electrolyte which allows ions to move more readily that in a raw potato.

It seems to have been made by the same guy who hoaxed the V-gate!!

This seems to suggest that you think the potato demonstration is a hoax.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0hK1wyrrAU

[agor95]

Big Troubles Brewing For The Theoretical Physics Smart-Set!!!

The Smart-Set are more affected by Vodka.
The smarter you are, Theoretical Physics, the more affected.

Cooking Potatoes before fermentation could make the Vodka more potent.

P.S. An on topic post !!!

[agor95]

Big Troubles Brewing For The Theoretical Physics Smart-Set!!!

The process of Observation, Result gathering & Mathematical Modelling.

When this forum shows examples of new original devices.

The above will also be possible. This will not effect previous results.

So no Trouble Brewing in that area.

Theoretical Physics - With difference Theories being presented now for the existing results. Trouble is always brewing.

Big Trouble - with the internet and forums like this; people are
questioning.
For example the cost of and value of Theoretical Physics.
As we had amateur astronomy.
We can have unpaid Mechanical Physic investigation Forums;
Both can be valid.

P.S. Another on topic post !

[Grimer]

Big Troubles Brewing For The Theoretical Physics Smart-Set!!!

The Smart-Set are more affected by Vodka.
The smarter you are, Theoretical Physics, the more affected.

Cooking Potatoes before fermentation could make the Vodka more potent.

P.S. An on topic post !!!

LOL. Good one. It took me some time before I made the connection with "Brewing". As you say, very much on topic. :-)

[Grimer]

...
As we had Ammeter astronomy.
...

I've heard of Radio astronomy but what on earth is "Ammeter astronomy"?
...
Oh, I see ..... you mean AMATEUR astronomy.

You had me worried for a moment there that I might be falling behind the class. ;-)

[nicbordeaux]

Nah, ammeter astronomy is a bloke waving around a long metal rod wired to an ammeter and checking for residual energy from the big bang on stormy nights. A lot of people got fried by zero point energy.

[Grimer]

That sounds very amateur. He's a shoo-in for an IGNOBEL PRIZE.

[agor95]

Thank you for the spelling correction.

amateur

P.S. I am just a couch potato really.
Or my subconscious mind started typing again.

[Grimer]

Possibly your spelling correction device trying to be helpful. It's too egregious for a typo.

[Grimer]

This isn't a magnetic motor. It is simpler than that.

Grimer, are you sure about that? It looks like it could be an electromagnetic motor to me.

It seems to me that you have ignored my arguments as to why it could work.

To be honest, I've been trying to ignore them!

Why don't you address them.

It could lead to me becoming upset again! ...lol

Is the calculus involved in the third derivative of position with respect to time too much for you?

Probably not, though for a really complex equation I might have to pull out an old calculus book or something.

When I was a kid I heard tell of a drivers' education teacher who would balance a tennis ball or golf ball or something like that on a pedestal on the dashboard of the drivers' ed car. He would then tell the student drivers to drive in such a manner that the ball didn't fall off of the pedestal - since of course new drivers tend to be a bit "jerky" in their driving.

Trying to keep that ball balanced, then, helped them to not do what new drivers tended to do - and things such as slamming on the brakes, flooring the accelerator or making too sudden of a turn.

So, quite obviously, there are times that we might want to limit the magnitude of that third derivative of position with respect to time - the rate of change of the acceleration. Jerky motion can even lead to "energy loss" in mechanical devices.

If you have a powerful engine and you floor the accelerator of your car, for example, that sudden change in acceleration of the drive train can cause wheels to lose traction with the road, and then the spinning of your wheels and the burning of the rubber isn't really transferring the available energy to where it is that you really want it to go.

For instance: is the rotating cam effectively a rotating pendulum or not?

Well, without considering the spring pressing against the cam, the addition of the cam on the shaft might give you a slightly out-of-balance wheel mechanism that could behave a bit like a pendulum, I suppose, giving a pendulous oscillation when it doesn't have enough kinetic energy to make it through a full rotation. Of course with enough kinetic energy, there would then be a pulsating rotation - a bit like you might have if you tried to spin a pendulum like a wheel.

When stationary, will it keel or not?

It probably will.

Ignore bearing friction, we are talking principles.

Yes or no - and if no, why.

Already answered. Probably yes.

If it's not a fake, and you're libelling of the builder by implication is unjustified, then you are in danger of throwing away a pearl of great price.

If this was such a valuable pearl, why did the fellow broadcast it to a bunch of youtube watching swine?! ;)

13:45. Again the kingdom of heaven is like to a merchant seeking good pearls.

I don't see that the sorts of pearls that I'm looking for are available from others, so I'm having to do my own pearl diving and oyster shucking.

13:46. Who when he had found one pearl of great price, went his way, and sold all that he had, and bought it.

I'm not sure if the thing you are talking about is even a pearl at all. It looks more like some sort of fake plastic bead to me! ...so to speak.

Elsewhere you claim,

Anyway, maybe due to my choices ... I actually do now have some interesting things I could share with the world of not just a technical nature but seemingly also of historical and "religious" ones, too.

I hope they include assuming people are innocent of fraud, a sin against the 8th commandment, until proved guilty beyond all reasonable doubt.

What if it includes seeing that the world is currently in the situation that the Bible said it would be in? ...and that lots of people are really really ignorant.

2477 Respect for the reputation of persons forbids every attitude and word likely to cause them unjust injury.
278 He becomes guilty: of rash judgment who, even tacitly, assumes as true, without sufficient foundation, the moral fault of a neighbor;

I've been in environments where people teasing, taunting, pranking and hoaxing each other was just the norm - where intelligent and/or (at least) playful people would try to get each other's goat.

When the fellow in the video says he's not "allowed" to tell you the brand name of the epoxy he's using, for instance, what does that tell you? Well, it is just one of the things that tell me that he's being silly and that it's all just a joke.

So, how would you test the "spirit" of such a prophet of perpetual motion?

I tell you that I have the eyes to see the spirit of a prankster! ...and to see the reaction of those who would fall for a deception.

***********************************************************
Thank you for your diligent post. I'd like to make the following points

Is the calculus involved in the third derivative of position with respect to time too much for you?

Probably not,...

In that case you're in a better position than most to understand what I am talking about.

For instance: is the rotating cam effectively a rotating pendulum or not?

Well, without considering the spring pressing against the cam, the addition of the cam on the shaft might give you a slightly out-of-balance wheel mechanism that could behave a bit like a pendulum, I suppose, giving a pendulous oscillation when it doesn't have enough kinetic energy to make it through a full rotation. Of course with enough kinetic energy, there would then be a pulsating rotation - a bit like you might have if you tried to spin a pendulum like a wheel.

You seem to have grasped that bit fairly well.

Unlike pcstru of Not the Steorn Forum. When I said that you could tell the Rubber Band Motor was a gravity motor because when you laid it on its side it ceased to work. He said I was an idiot and talking rubbish (typical response for that forum).

Later when he'd thought about it, or experimented perhaps, he grudgingly admitted I was right.

When stationary, will it keel or not?

It probably will.

Ignore bearing friction, we are talking principles.
Yes or no - and if no, why.

Already answered. Probably yes.

There's no "probably" about it. The answer is yes.
Matt 5:37. But let your speech be yea, yea: no, no: and that which is over
and above these, is of evil.
Which means your "probably" is from the devil as a different translation puts it.
And if you don't believe in the devil you'll never understand Bessler.

If it's not a fake, and you're libelling of the builder by implication is unjustified, then you are in danger of throwing away a pearl of great price.

If this was such a valuable pearl, why did the fellow broadcast it to a bunch of youtube watching swine?! ;)

I'm glad you used an emoticon there or I might have thought you were a Killary supporter.

If I had just built a device which showed such interesting behaviour I would be intrigued and want to share my experience with others. He's done this via the medium of YouTube. If the device is genuine I think his action is perfectly understandable.

And now I have to break off for my dinner.