This should have worked if oob wheels will work

[Vic Hays]

Out of balance by position and mass are both in this wheel. Back forces cancel motion.

[jim_mich]

I remember this one. At first glance it would seem to want to turn. All the forces balance and it just sits there.

[Vic Hays]

Horsepower is x amount of weight times x amount of height in x amount of time. Without some other principle what goes up comes down and there is no gain.

Bessler 9 also slows the weights as they descend and speeds them up on the ascent. If rapid up and slow down was the principle this wheel had that too.

[jim_mich]

We need a rapid upward movement of the center of gravity with a slow downward movement of the center of gravity while keeping the center of gravity shifted sideways to the decending side most of the time.

[LustInBlack]

Jim this is exactly the path of my idea .....

[Vic Hays]

Jim

In other words all torque from lifting and lowering the weights would drive the wheel in the same direction rather than countering each other.

I still prefer CF as the most likely solution.

[jim_mich]

Vic, yes about the torque.

But there's no reason that CF cannot be used. The above CoG path was generated by a computer program analyzing weights being moved by CF and gravity. It's the CoG path of one set of "pair of pairs" weights. When a second (or more) pairs are used then the CoG point stays smack in the middle of the green ring, which makes it always OOB.

[wheelrite]

and i guess that would give you 'one side full the other empty'
Regards
J

[wikiwheel]

vik

I tried your sketcht out in the shop on a wheel. I work on capital hill in a machine shop (like hvac) and have access to all sorts of presses and cutters and benders.

Your right it doesnt look like its a worker. No matter how connected, always finds a deader spot.

mik

[rlortie]

My forgone conlusion some months ago, was that this design would not work as there is a symetrical equalization between the two set of spokes.

But yet if you look at it as I have edited, you have to ask yourself why this would not work? Maybe it simply needs a third disk!

Ralph

[Vic Hays]

and i guess that would give you 'one side full the other empty'
Regards
J

One side is fuller and one side is emptier. To acheive this requires torque that counteracts gravity.

[Vic Hays]

vik

I tried your sketcht out in the shop on a wheel. I work on capital hill in a machine shop (like hvac) and have access to all sorts of presses and cutters and benders.

Your right it doesnt look like its a worker. No matter how connected, always finds a deader spot.

mik

A gravity wheel is going to need some dynamic forces to work. This particular design incorporated all of the simple forces and actions I could think of and yet it ends at zero net torque.

[Vic Hays]

My forgone conlusion some months ago, was that this design would not work as there is a symetrical equalization between the two set of spokes.

But yet if you look at it as I have edited, you have to ask yourself why this would not work? Maybe it simply needs a third disk!

Ralph

Intuitively it does appear that it should work.
Maybe you can make a working wheel and maybe the third disk will produce the countertorque to balance.

[jim_mich]

Intuition is based on past experiences and cannot always be relied on. Think of the first time you saw a spinning gyroscope resting on a stand hanging out to one side with nothing holding it there. Your intuition said it must fall. But it didn't fall as long as it was spinning and turning slowly around the stand. So a gyroscope is a special case where intuition fails. It is also a case that would seem impossible until you see it happen. I think whatever powered Bessler's wheels will be similar. It will be like the spinning gyroscope; it will be a special sitiation that goes against our intuition. It will make sense once we know how it works. And just like the spinning gyroscope it will follow Newtons laws of physics but will give results that go against our intuition.

[scott]

I completely agree Jim. Thanks for yet another great post.

-Scott