Game Plan

[aStillMoreGloriousDawn]

Hello All!

Based on previous polls, it appears the vast majority of members here believe a PM machine will be created or replicated in the near future. It would, of course, then be in the best interest of the inventor to have a solid game plan for utilizing their new found discovery. I know this question has been raised a few times in the past, but it was asked as in "what would you, personally, do?" I think we should create a collaborative effort in answering all(or most) of the "what ifs" involved in different scenarios.

Examples:
-If the theory of Big Oil Suppression is true, how can the inventor protect his family or those he holds dear?
-What if the inventor is living paycheck to paycheck, with a big mortgage and children to care for.. and thus he cannot commit any of his own money to promoting the technology?
-What if the inventor is already a millionaire? Should he patent it and build a factory? Is there anything standing in his way?
-What type of plan could be put into place, in case the inventor was ever harmed/"suppressed", to ensure the technology isn't lost?

I think these questions should be answered, because when asked what they would do, most members said they didn't know.

I'm hoping several more scenarios will be questioned, with a good variety of answers to follow.
If a thread indeed has been created for the specific purpose of covering all the bases, please direct me to it.

Thanks.

[jim_mich]

My 'PLAN'... (I posted this a while back.)

A] First get something that works!!!

B] Take steps to insure the idea survives in case of calamity.

C] Define the principle or the reason why it works!

D] Design a simple cheap working POP (proof of principle) sample model.

E] (omitted by mistake)

F] Build as many of these models as money/time/reasoning suggest.

G] Plan Ad campaign, including literature, web space, documentation, etc.

H] Write patent applications for most major countries.

I] Prepare a list of names, addresses of who is to receive what.

J] Always continue research into increasing power output and alternate designs.

K] Load up on liability and life insurance.

L] When all is prepared, file patents, upload web site, mail plans, ship models, etc. Hit the media hard! Make a sensation! Be on the evening news worldwide.

Do what needs to be done to keep those in power from suppressing your invention. It is much harder to put the genie back into the bottle after everyone has seen it. They move slow. You must move fast. The window of opportunity is between when the PTO receives your application and when someone reviewing it realizes what your invention really does.

Just my humble opinion.

[aStillMoreGloriousDawn]

Yep, I saw your game plan on that thread. Thanks for taking the time to post it again, Jim.

[rasselas]

I agree that these questions (and others) are important. To summarize the views of the majority imo:

1) many wish to simply publish the info on the forum, and have it disseminated across the internet. Their motives for this is a) they're of low income (etc) and don't wish to struggle with patents, etc. b) it's quick, c) it seems to circumvent some of the other questions like "what happens if I die, or how to protect my family?", d) it's easy.

Problems with #1 are: ???

2) a second main viewpoint of the people on this forum seems to be to patent the technology and from their to attempt to create a start-up, or sell/license the technology. Reasons include: a) they will get money for their efforts, b) they will have security of recognition (more so than dissemintation via internet most likely) c) they have a say over how the technology gets used, d) they have a secure platform into which to COLLABORATIVELY develop the project.

Problems with #2 include: ???

Other questions:
* What are some reasons for wanting to "control how the technology is used"?
* That is, what are some negative potentials of PM?
* How COULD we arrange a safe-collaborative group IF we so chose to?
(this would include both legalities (nda's, patents, contracts, etc), but also supporting technologies and group-
infrastructure (eg, do we utilize private forums? encrypted webcams? have a group "for-your-eyes-only" policy?)
* Who's going to be me a new BMW when they become wealthy?!?!?

Seriously, I'm sure there are many conflicting viewpoints to come, so let's be aware that this is (and/or probably should be) of a speculative nature for now, that perhaps meaning, "It may change..." So take these (somewhat controversial) topics in stride... [as they may seem more of a personal nature than technical ideas of mechanical application].

[justsomeone]

Question Jim. If you have to get permission to file patents in other countries, how does that effect your plan?

[getterdone]

I like Fletchers plan, just do it for the bragging rights.

[rasselas]

Some more ideas/questions:

Is anybody (like Jim_Mich, Arrache, etc) familiar with: USC Title 35 Chapter 17 Section 181-182, 187?
Or Decision BL O/044/06, John Frederick Willmott's application no. 0502841
Or Decision BL O/150/06, Ezra Shimshi's application no. 0417271
etc... that is:

* How likely is it that we can succesfully get a patent? [note: there's more aspects to this question than mentioned above]

* Suppose that a person ALREADY has a PM device, what steps would you recommend to them? I would think a different strategy would be wisely suggested. (eg, would you recommend that they try to win a million-dollar cash prize to fund their operations (such as the nobel prize etc (just for ex.))).

* Would you bid them be patient... or pursue things quickly, as other's may/will invent a machine and patent it, pulling the rug out from under them, so to speak?

[jim_mich]

Is anybody (like Jim_Mich, Arrache, etc) familiar with: USC Title 35 Chapter 17 Section 181-182, 187?

TITLE 35 > PART II > CHAPTER 17—SECRECY OF CERTAIN INVENTIONS AND FILING APPLICATIONS IN FOREIGN COUNTRY
§ 181. Secrecy of certain inventions and withholding of patent

Whenever the publication or disclosure of an invention by the publication of an application or by the granting of a patent, in which the Government does not have a property interest, might, in the opinion of the Commissioner of Patents, be detrimental to the national security, he shall make the application for patent in which such invention is disclosed available for inspection to the Atomic Energy Commission, the Secretary of Defense, and the chief officer of any other department or agency of the Government designated by the President as a defense agency of the United States.
-- snip --
the Commissioner of Patents shall order that the invention be kept secret and shall withhold the publication of the application or the grant of a patent for such period as the national interest requires, and notify the applicant thereof. Upon proper showing by the head of the department or agency who caused the secrecy order to be issued that the examination of the application might jeopardize the national interest, the Commissioner of Patents shall thereupon maintain the application in a sealed condition and notify the applicant thereof.
-- snip --
An invention shall not be ordered kept secret and the publication of the application or the grant of a patent withheld for a period of more than one year. The Commissioner of Patents shall renew the order at the end thereof, or at the end of any renewal period, for additional periods of one year upon notification by the head of the department or the chief officer of the agency who caused the order to be issued that an affirmative determination has been made that the national interest continues so to require.

§ 182. Abandonment of invention for unauthorized disclosure

The invention disclosed in an application for patent subject to an order made pursuant to section 181 of this title may be held abandoned upon its being established by the Commissioner of Patents that in violation of said order the invention has been published or disclosed or that an application for a patent therefor has been filed in a foreign country by the inventor, his successors, assigns, or legal representatives, or anyone in privity with him or them, without the consent of the Commissioner of Patents. The abandonment shall be held to have occurred as of the time of violation. The consent of the Commissioner of Patents shall not be given without the concurrence of the heads of the departments and the chief officers of the agencies who caused the order to be issued. A holding of abandonment shall constitute forfeiture by the applicant, his successors, assigns, or legal representatives, or anyone in privity with him or them, of all claims against the United States based upon such invention.

Whether patent application number GB 0502841.0 (John Frederick Willmott's application) complies with section 1(1)(c)

The application relates to a system for propelling a vehicle. Specifically the invention claims to power a car engine using compressed air provided by an on-board compressor. The compressor is driven by an on-board electric motor which in turn receives its power from an on-board battery. According to the invention the battery is charged by an alternator driven by the engine. The single claim states that the system is a “self sustaining unit that will run without the use of fossil based fuel�. The claim goes on to state that the system will “inhale its ambient atmosphere and therefore exhale the same but warmer�. That the system is not intended to require any external energy inputs was confirmed by Mr Willmott at the hearing.

Whether patent application number GB 0417271.4 (Ezra Shimshi's application) relates to a patentable invention

The application relates to an apparatus which is alleged to generate energy using the combined effects of gravity, buoyancy and atmospheric pressure. The apparatus is made up of a weighted hollow shaft mounted for rotation about a horizontal axis. A vented container with liquid and a gas-filled buoy is fixed to each end of the shaft. The buoys are connected via the hollow shaft for reciprocating movement and via a further pipe with a 2-way valve to allow gas to flow between the buoys on rotation of the apparatus.

In both these patent applications there was never any proof that they would work. The first step must be to find something that works! Then, when you have everything in place, you file a patent application and within a day or so you release the details to the public. You cannot be suppressed after you have made the information public. It's a matter of the government "saving face". After you have shown the world your actual working machine then the "powers that be" cannot stuff the information back into the genie bottle. Since you filed the patent application before going public you are still entitled to a patent, even in other countries, assuming the application is very well written. Normally a patent application gets an automatic foreign filing license granted with the return receipt. Only inventions with possible military applications won't include the license.

As far as funding goes, if you get something that actually works, and can prove that it works by having an actual working machine, then there are many investors that would be more than willing to fund your invention. Of course you would need to give them a substantial cut or maybe one might want a full buyout?

As for myself, if I were so fortunate as to discover Bessler's secret, I believe I have enough resources to get a patent and to start up a small manufacturing company. I would not risk my retirement fund unless I was very sure of making a profit and not losing it all.

[rlortie]

Dawn,

I just added a hit to your reputation bar allowing you to earn your first green dot.

'Arrache' is prepared to meet all of the above pro's and cons involved with patenting, financing and the right political forces to meet the opposition.

We even have tax depreciation incentives as well as accelerated tax depreciation. Promissory investors and entrepreneurs are only a phone call away.

As for a patent not being granted for national security reasons, I always found it amusing that Julius Robert Oppenheimer received a patent for the atomic bomb!

Ralph

[FunWithGravity2]

The single claim states that the system is a “self sustaining unit that will run without the use of fossil based fuel�. The claim goes on to state that the system will “inhale its ambient atmosphere and therefore exhale the same but warmer�. That the system is not intended to require any external energy inputs was confirmed by Mr Willmott at the hearing.


Any idiot who throws that in the application, never mind his only claim is asking for trouble. That and i "assume" he had no new or novel use of anything.

A method and apparartus for creating.......... motion in a rotatating enviroment. If its a novel arrangement that is mechanically different from any other setup it will be granted a patent based on the mechanical arrangement. If you can define method/principle well enough you will also be covering you basis quite well, if you can't, well.

Self sustaining/perpetual. you might want to leave that out, unless you want to deal with arguing semantics with every idiot on the planet until you die.

Dave

[Ed]

Based on previous polls, it appears the vast majority of members here believe a PM machine will be created or replicated in the near future. It would, of course, then be in the best interest of the inventor to have a solid game plan for utilizing their new found discovery.

The statement "I don't see how it wouldn't work!" has for centuries been responsible for people thinking they are very close to the solution, but what would be in the best interest of the inventor would be to invent the damned thing already!

[rasselas]

As for a patent not being granted for national security reasons, I always found it amusing that Julius Robert Oppenheimer received a patent for the atomic bomb!

Concerning United States Patent Law: Title 35, (Sections 181-188)... this law was only put in place in 1952... several years after Oppenheimer co-created the A-Bomb.

There were 5,135 inventions that were under secrecy orders at the end of Fiscal Year 2010, the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office told Secrecy News last week. It’s a 1% rise over the year before, and the highest total in more than a decade.

A 1971 list of confiscated items indicates that patents for solar photovoltaic generators were subject to review and possible restriction if the photovoltaics were more than 20% efficient. Energy conversion systems were likewise subject to review and possible restriction if they offered conversion efficiencies “in excess of 70-80%.�
One may fairly ask if disclosure of such technologies could really have been “detrimental to the national security,� or whether the opposite would be closer to the truth [ie, "national security" proved to be harmful to the advancement of constructive technologies].
{text referenced above adapted from http://www.svpvril.com/Title35.html}


So... summarizing the above, it seems to me that devices that dramatically boost energy efficiency or create energy [read: compete with oil?] stand a good chance of being confiscated.

Whenever the publication or disclosure of an invention by the publication of an application or by the granting of a patent, in which the Government does not have a property interest, might, in the opinion of the Commissioner of Patents, be detrimental to the national security,

As it only requires his "opinion", this implies that there is not even some legal "red tape" to protect you or fall back upon... and that further it is then questionable whether seeking to fight or appeal such measures might result in complete and permanent forfeiture of rights to the product (as well as probable imprisonment and fines).

Rass

PS - I like the information posted so far guys, very helpful... and note, perhaps this very thread might be what you personally will use someday upon your invention... but it won't be much without these and more helpful contributions

[greendoor]

If the theory of Big Oil Suppression is true, how can the inventor protect his family or those he holds dear?

Big Oil stops at nothing. The so-called presidents of the USA dance to the tune of big oil, and will wage war on entire countries if commanded to do so. The death of an inventor and his/her family is small peanuts in comparison. But first, you would have to pose a serious threat to them. At the moment, most of us are simply crazy deluded dreamers of no consequence. But if any single one of us stumbled on the secret of a free energy power source that threatened the current balance of power, it is a complete no-brainer that strong force would be applied to remove the threat. If you are concerned about your well being or your families well being, don't become that threat. Or cooperate fully if threatened. That's all you can do - and suspect this has happened many times before.

I saw a recent statistic recently about the number of very recent patents that are kept secret for military security reasons. I guess most of those inventors are already in the employ of the military - but I guess a number of those inventors are visited and told to shut up or face the consequences.

We are naive idiots if we expect a patent office to protect us if we happened to discover the big one.

What if the inventor is living paycheck to paycheck, with a big mortgage and children to care for.. and thus he cannot commit any of his own money to promoting the technology?

Any free energy idea is totally worthless without a proof of principle experiment. Just having an idea, and hoping somebody else will fund the experiment is worthless. But the Bessler wheel concept does not require high technology - it should be fairly cheap, should the idea be discovered again.

If you could build a working proof of principle, then you have no reason not be able to succeed with limited start up capital. First up, power your own home. That will save you money. If you have friends you trust, power their homes. Perfect the technology. Then invest in businesses that have a high energy component. With free energy, you will be able to prosper in those businesses. Keep it low key - don't make rash promises and get yourself imprisoned.

What if the inventor is already a millionaire? Should he patent it and build a factory? Is there anything standing in his way?

The way to succeed in business (or in war for that matter) is to know something that nobody else knows. Sure: build a factory, but not a PM device factory. Use the free energy to gain an advantage, and build up the security and legal systems to be able to withstand the inevitable attacks from vicious rivals with deep pockets. Don't be naive.

What type of plan could be put into place, in case the inventor was ever harmed/"suppressed", to ensure the technology isn't lost?

Some of us have maybe had the idea of using the internet to release confidential information in the event of a death or some interaction. This could be done fairly easily, if you had several servers in various locations that required you to keep updated on a reqular basis, otherwise it would automatically release the information to a pre-defined list of recipients.

However - ANYTHING - involving the internet would ensure failure, because you can't keep anything secret. Google pretty much own the internet - and if you displease Google, they have the technology and power to prevent you doing anything. I do not believe that Google is a benign company that just got lucky. I believe they are resourced and controlled by higher powers - the war was fought and won, and we played right into their hands.

Google are investing in some very interesting free energy technology of their own. (Unless they simply bought it out to supress it - time will tell). So they have their own vested interests to protect.

FWIW - Google are said to be investing in high altitude wind turbines. Basically, flying platforms suspended by two cables/conductors. The jet steams above earth have massive energy continuously available. So these flying power stations can deliver more megawatts than a nuclear power plant of similar surface area. This is perfectly viable 'free energy' - but it won't be free energy for the peasants. It will be big money to the overlords who own the technology, and sell the energy at market prices to the peasants.

Interesting times.

[jim_mich]

http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/invention/pscrl.pdf

ARMED SERVICES PATENT ADVISORY BOARD
"ASPAB"
PATENT SECURITY CATEGORY REVIEW LIST
PREPARED BY ASPAB SUB-COMMl1TEE
CHAIRMAN: H.L. MOURNING, AMC
J.C. MORRIS, AF
BERT CONVEY, NAVY
JANUARY 1971
[Originally classified Confidential - Now Unclassified)
Short Title: PSCRL-l
PATENT SECURITY CATEGORY REVIEW UST

Atomic Energy Commission .................................. (AEC)
For AEC, substitute DOE - Department of Energy 1994

This date means that the list was still being used as late as 1994.

Group X • Propulsion Systems, Propellants, and Fuels
-- snip --
Item 25. Auxiliary power supply systems of all types suitable for space crafts (NASA)

Unlimited power for space craft?

Group XI - Power Supply
-- snip --
Item 9. Energy conversion systems with conversion efficiencies in excess of 70-S0% (AP) (NA VY)(AMC) 8178

Thus working perpetual motion machines would be included because they would be more efficient than 100%.

XXIX INSTRUMENTATION & TECHNIQUES USEFUL IN AERONAUTICAL AND SPACE RESEARCH & ACTIVITIES (NASA only)
-- snip --
REMARKS:
The above category list is not exclusive. We would like to examine any application which, in the judgment of the examiner, has significant use in aeronautical and space activities. We will from time to time amend this list to keep it as current as possible.

Seems to cover a very broad range of inventions?

[rasselas]

Edited: Post temporarily removed... I'll re-add later.