black lives matter

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preoccupied
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black lives matter

Post by preoccupied »

Do you think that lady who posted a video on facebook of her boyfriend being shot in the arm from a traffic stop will go to jail for trying to make the police officer look bad? It's not freedom of speech because it resulted in a terrorist attack, when later a veteran went on a shooting spree because he got angry about it. So I think she might fit one of the crimes that relate to inciting violence against the government. The biggest thing that I think might prosecute her is if she was lying about what the police officer said. The police officer said he said I told you not to move. The lady in the video said that the officer asked for ID and then shot her boyfriend for no reason, which I just think is very unlikely. So if she was lying to make the police officer look bad, I think she could be charged with a crime of inciting violence against the government. I think that the laws for this are comparable to treason so maybe she could get the death penalty, and that would be ironic, because all of the anger is coming about because black people are dying.
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re: black lives matter

Post by daanopperman »

It seems not to matter for those who lost their lives . If the law , armed , with a array of lethal weapons , confront you , you do not resist , call his grandma names , or show your angry side , you do as told if you have nothing to hide , and speedily be on your merry way .
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Post by AB Hammer »

What get me is the mentality of what is going on from the far left.

Someone gets shot by a crazy or jihadist and their answer is. Get rid of the guns so we can't protect ourselves.

Several member of the BLM are calling to disband all police so there is no one to protect the people.

As some have said in the past. Going to hell in a hand basket.
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re: black lives matter

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AB Hammer what you said was very extreme because you act as if the solution is being proposed of getting rid of guns entirely, but that's not gun control. Gun control is like a military security clearance. The better we are able to assess people who own guns, the better those guns will be used responsibly. The Muslim guy who attacked a gay bar was refused weapons by a store owner when he tried to buy armor and weapons because the store owners suspected he wanted to go on a shooting spree. If the store required identification at the door, he would have never been able to do that terrorist attack, because the police would have stopped him when the store owner reported his suspicion. Porn stores require identification at the door. If selling guns were as strict as selling porn then that terrorist attack would not have happened. Gun control could be very strong potentially and psychologically test people who would own guns, and then there just wouldn't be gun related crimes, because people interested in gang activity would come up on lie detector tests or other tests. You want gun owners to be an extension of the military in case there is a violent threat to oneself, but even military work has its security clearances.

The guy who was shot in the arm, if he were told not to move first, was committing a crime before he was shot by trying to get his ID for the cop. I do not agree that a lot of controversy has existed over black men being shot, who were in the middle of committing violent crimes or were just breaking the law. Police can shoot people who are breaking the law and appear to be dangerous. There is no reasonable way to police people if they can't do this. To disband all police would be entirely retarded.
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re: black lives matter

Post by ovyyus »

preoccupied wrote:Police can shoot people who are breaking the law and appear to be dangerous. There is no reasonable way to police people if they can't do this.
From a USA outsider... it seems to me that many police shootings are the result of police officers acting in defense of themselves rather than defense of a public or a law. Teaching citizens to be free and brave seems at odds with police forcing them into subservience?
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re: black lives matter

Post by AB Hammer »

Without laws there is chaos and when people don't respect the law, there is confrontations and crimes. Chicago is a prime example. 2,600+ so far this year of black on black killings/murders. The police is the first line of defense to chaos. People need to understand that you don't go mouthing off at the police to get respect and when they are confronted for breaking the law and then resist expecting that the police will just go away is a pipe dream. For example in Battonruge La. the man resisting arrest and reaching for his gun while police trying to cuff him got him shot. Nothing else would have got him shot. If he would have respected the law he would be alive today and black lives matter and the far left would not be able to twist the story to be a bunch of lies and problems.
I respect equality and I hate racism no matter what direction it is coming from and so far I see the BLM as a racist organization along with groups like the KKK.

In life you have to show respect to get respect. Thus the statement that you have to earn respect. There is no respect due to those who destroy the place. The police have shown great restraint and have earned respect.
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Re: re: black lives matter

Post by preoccupied »

ovyyus wrote:
preoccupied wrote:Police can shoot people who are breaking the law and appear to be dangerous. There is no reasonable way to police people if they can't do this.
From a USA outsider... it seems to me that many police shootings are the result of police officers acting in defense of themselves rather than defense of a public or a law. Teaching citizens to be free and brave seems at odds with police forcing them into subservience?
When I saw on the news about black men being shot by police recently, I wanted to learn more about it so I watched a few hours of Cops on Spike TV. Police officers will ask you to sit on the ground just to talk to you. They will hand cuff you but you're not under arrest until they say so. You do whatever a cop wants and they let you go if there is no crime. If you do anything against what the cop is asking from you, you go to jail for obstruction even if you hadn't committed a crime other than that. But I don't think cops interfere with any political agenda and there is no reason to be free and brave during a police interrogation or when they do crowd control on protests. Protests against George W. Bush used to be positioned very far from him. You can still protest just not wherever you want. It's possibly more than you can get in Russia but not much more and that's okay, because we don't need our streets and businesses blocked or the President of the USA endangered. I mean I can't quite put it to words but I think you Ovyyus are trying to be silly by saying that freedom is obstructed by police being able to express authority ovyyus.
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Post by ME »

http://www.un.org/en/universal-declarat ... an-rights/

Article 9 ! (arbitrary arrest, that's the main question I think)

perhaps number 5 included. (degrading treatment: handcuffs )

I think article 1 as well (act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood)
Basically the topic is about article 2 (without distinction of any kind)
Article 3 is at least temporarily in conflict (liberty versus(?)security)
Perhaps 4 with a bit of creativity... but perhaps stretching here (servitude = bondage?)
Article 6: (recognition as a person before the law)
7. All are equal (police are people too)
....
Likely more to be found there.
Perhaps not all article apply exactly without using some creativity, but it makes one think.
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re: black lives matter

Post by ovyyus »

preoccupied wrote:Police officers will ask you to sit on the ground just to talk to you. They will hand cuff you but you're not under arrest until they say so.
I certainly wasn't trying to be silly. In Australia, we are not forced to sit on the ground or be handcuffed by police in order for them to ask questions. I think if that were the case here then most citizens would seriously question such uncivilised tactics, and perhaps look for some underlying agenda. Ramping up the potential for conflict with the public probably suits corporations profiting from the resultant high incarceration rates.
preoccupied wrote:But I don't think cops interfere with any political agenda...
Most laws are the result of political agenda. A law can only be effective if it is willingly policed.
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re: black lives matter

Post by preoccupied »

I don't know about Australia, but in the USA there is a flight risk for people talking to police and some people look like they might be anxious or untrustworthy before it's determined that they have committed a crime. It is not degrading treatment to be put in hand cuffs or asked to sit down or be examined/searched. It is not uncivilized tactics. It's not. In the TV show Cops that I was watching on Spike TV, the cops that did not ask people to sit on the ground more likely ended up in dangerous situations or they ran away and had to be chased. The more invasive policing method I saw on TV was so much more effective, that everybody should be okay with it. It's not like being strip searched and anally probed for the fun of making recreational videos for cops. That would be inappropriate. And nothing degrading like that is happening.
Last edited by preoccupied on Sat Jul 16, 2016 2:28 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by AB Hammer »

You will only find those action if the call deems possible problems like if they have been arrested before. I have never seen a standard citizen done in that manner and my Brother has been a policeman and even capt. of police in one town. I also worked as an armed guard many years ago. The only time cuffs are used is if trouble is expected or you are being arrested.
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Post by ME »

It is not degrading treatment to be put in hand cuffs or asked to sit down or be examined/searched. It is not uncivilized tactics. It's not.
Preoccupied, you are kidding, right?...right? Or at least I hope your are....
Did any people who came to tea, beer or dinner ever came back the next time?

Now I thought about it, it's a bit weird (read: not justifiable) normal citizens are allowed to carry/own heavier arms than the ones who are appointed to "serve & protect" in providing "safety & security".
There are basically two roads to take in balancing this scale...Choose wisely!
With such out-of-balance situation it is no wonder (although no excuse) some officers can get 'over-protective' sometimes and break-down in what should ideally be a social human-to-human interaction with only inferred authority.

But what do I know... I live in a land far, far away partially below sea-level.
Luckily we have TV-shows providing some nuanced insights into the daily adventures of the average policeman. :-/
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re: black lives matter

Post by WaltzCee »

All lives matter to some extent. Some times some more than others.
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Post by Fcdriver »

The blaming of the deaths as to their color is a oxymoron by the Obama administration.

When a Muslim does something wrong and gets killed by the police, great lengths are taken to try to claim, that the persons actions were not because he was Muslim.

When a black person does something wrong, and gets shot by polices, it is because he was black!
, but not for no other reason!

When a white guy does something wrong and gets killed by police, it is because they were a thug acting as a thug.

This manly only proves that Obama is more Muslim than he is black!

If he really felt kinship to blacks, he would be upset about the thousands that are killing each other every year, instead of just a few killed by police.
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re: black lives matter

Post by daanopperman »

Just wandren who them lawmen was protecting , when they nailed the Savior to the cross .
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