German description of BW's working principle from private person

A Bessler, gravity, free-energy free-for-all. Registered users can upload files, conduct polls, and more...

Moderator: scott

Post Reply
jonnynet
Aficionado
Aficionado
Posts: 347
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 8:34 pm
Location: Leipzig, Saxony, Germany

German description of BW's working principle from private pe

Post by jonnynet »

By chance I found some interesting writing. There's a german web portal, where people can ask various questions and everyone can answer. Someone made a non-working replica of the Besslerwheel and asked if he built something wrong or the Besserwheel is only a mythos. Then he got the following answer:
Wenn ein Rad, wie das von Bessler, selbstätig laufen soll, braucht es eine Unwuchtmasse nahe dem Umfang, um bei einer Drehung nach unten Fallarbeit an die Welle abzugeben. Es ist nicht ratsam – aber auch nicht verkehrt, auf der gegenübeliegenden Seite einen zusätzlichen, gleich großen Körper aufsteigen zu lassen – aber mit kleinerem Radiusabstand zur Welle. Dann braucht man aber auch noch eine Vorrichtung, die den Radiusabstand nach 180° Drehwinkel verändert und hat außerdem den Nachteil, dass fast die ganze Fallarbeit wieder für den Hub der Gegenmasse verbraucht wird.

Bessler wusste das – im Mittelalter hatte man mehr Ruhe zum Nachdenken - und darum wollte er auf die Gegenmasse verzichten und die gesamte Fallarbeit der runterdrehenden Unwucht nutzen. Dazu brauchte er aber wiederum einen Körper, mit dem er die heruntergedrehte Masse hochziehen lassen konnte.

Wo sollte der Körper aber bleiben, bis er gebraucht wurde? Genau, nur in der Radmitte war dafür Platz. Also erfand Bessler den Diagonal-Schieber auf dem das Gegengewicht befestigt war, die Schiebermasse mit eingerechnet.

Die Unwucht konnte nun aber nicht einfach auf der Radscheibe kleben, sonst wäre sie ja auf der Gegenseite wieder nach oben gedreht und hätte damit ihre ganze geleistete Fallarbeit verbraucht. Darum befestigte Bessler die Unwuchtgewichte auf einem Paar gegenübeliegender, drehbarer Arme, die sich unabhängig vom Drehwinkel der Radscheibe bewegen ließen. Nun konnte er folgendes Programm anwenden:

1) Unwucht-Hebel-Paar starr mit der Drehung des Rades nach unten drehen, Drehwinkel 180°.

2) Unten angekommen, das Gegengewicht aus der Radmitte loslassen und die Unwuchtgewichte wieder hochziehen, während das Rad langsam weiterdreht. Gegengewicht befindet sich dann unten und die Unwucht oben.

3) Rad mit Gegengewicht auf der einen Seite und Unwucht auf der anderen so weit drehen lassen, bis die Unwucht wieder unten und das Gegengewicht oben ist.

4) Gegengewicht in die Radmitte zurückfallen lassen und dabei die Unwuchtarme endgültig nach oben ziehen.

Damit ist der Kreisprozess geschlossen und die Unwucht kann wieder in Abwärtsrichtung die nächste Fallarbeit leisten... usw.
The author added some more assumptions of how the wheel can work:
Das Besslerrad ist getaktet. Es überträgt mit jeder vollen Umdrehung einmal die volle Unwucht-Fallarbeit auf die Welle. Zur Wiederherstellung der Arbeitsfähigkeit wird ein Gegengewicht aus der Radmitte gezogen und im Gleichgewichts-Takt um 180° gedreht - danach ist wieder die volle Fallhöhe der Unwucht hergestellt. Für die Rückhebung der Unwucht mit Unterstützung des Gegengewichtes wendet Bessler einen neuartigen 2-Drehpunkt-Hebel an, worin eigentlich die wahre Meisterleistung seiner Mechanik besteht. Das muss man wissen, wenn man weiterkommen will.
Die Bessler-Unwucht besteht aus 2 gegenüberliegenden Armen, die auf der Radscheibe drehbar befestigt sind und über die 2-Punkt-Hebel-Mechanik mit dem Gegengewicht in Form eines Diagonal-Schiebers mit Schlitz in Verbindung stehen.

Das Problem, das Bessler zu lösen hatte, war der Umstand, dass die Unwuchtarme über den gesamten Durchmesser des Rades gehoben werden müssen, das Gegengewicht aber nur die Fallhöhe des Rad-Radiuses zur Verfügung hatte.

Bessler musste also eine Trick finden, die Energie des normalen 1-Punkt-Hebels sekundärseitig zu erhöhen...

Heute würde man sagen, der Hebel erzeugt Energie, wo keine ist.

Aber nach den Gesetzen der Drehmomentübertragung sorgt der 2-te Drehpunkt des Hebels für die Verlängerung des Weges am kurzen, also starken Hebelarm.

Diese Erfindung ist bis heute nicht ein zweites Mal entdeckt worden, schon allein aus dem banalen Grund, weil sie anscheinend dem Energie-Erhaltungssatz widerspricht - was natürlich Unsinn ist, sog. UNIFUG, weil es sich dabei um einen Energie-Transformationsvorgang handelt, der am Speicher der Gravitations-Energie ansetzt.

Tja, zuviel studiert nicht immer auch zum Ziele führt.
I find this quite astonishing because it really sounds that someone has a clear understanding about the workings of the Besslerwheel. If I only could make a picture of all that. I would almost assume the author does know the secret and already built something real that works. I did some corrections of the text to make a good translation possible. But this will take me some serious time. It's very likely that any machine translation won't lead to a useful result. But if I can make an ideal translation, maybe one of you can then take something useful from it, which would be great.
User avatar
Fletcher
Addict
Addict
Posts: 8200
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2003 9:03 am
Location: NZ

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by Fletcher »

Well, just for fun then, I might as well put up the German to English Google Translation while you clean it up jonnynet.

If a wheel, such as that of Bessler, is intended to run automatically, an imbalance mass is required near the circumference in order to give down the case to the shaft during downward rotation. It is not advisable - but it is not wrong to have an additional body of the same size on the opposing side - but with a smaller radius distance to the shaft. Then, however, one also needs a device which changes the radius distance after 180 ° angle of rotation and also has the disadvantage that almost the entire case work is consumed again for the stroke of the counter mass.

Bessler knew this - in the Middle Ages one had more peace to think about - and therefore he wanted to dispense with the counter masses and use the entire case work of the down-turning imbalance. For this, however, he needed a body with which he could have the mass rolled down.

But where should the body remain until it is needed? Exactly, only in the wheel center was place for it. So Bessler invented the diagonal slider on which the counterweight was fastened, the slider mass with.

The imbalance could not simply stick to the wheel disc, otherwise it would have turned on the other side again upwards and would thus have consumed their entire case work. For this reason Bessler fixed the unbalance weights on a pair of opposing, rotatable arms, which could be moved independently of the angle of rotation of the wheel disc. Now he could use the following program:

1) Unbalance lever pair rotate rigidly with the rotation of the wheel, rotation angle 180 °.

2) At the bottom, release the counterweight from the wheel center and pull the unbalance weights up again as the wheel slowly rotates. Counterweight is then down and the unbalance is up.

3) Turn counterweight wheel on one side and unbalance on the other so far until the unbalance is down again and the counterweight is up.

4) Loosen counterweight in the wheel center and pull the imbalance arms upwards.

This closes the crimping process and the imbalance can make the next case work again in the downward direction ... etc.

..........

The Besslerrad is clocked. It transmits the full unbalance case work to the shaft once with every full rotation. In order to restore the working capacity, a counterweight is pulled out of the wheel center and rotated by 180 ° at equilibrium intervals, after which the full fall height of the unbalance is restored. Bessler applies a new 2-point lever for the lifting of the unbalance with the help of the counterweight, which is actually the true masterpiece of its mechanics. You have to know that if you want to go further.

..........

If a wheel, such as that of Bessler, is intended to run automatically, an imbalance mass is required near the circumference in order to give down the case to the shaft during downward rotation. It is not advisable - but it is not wrong to have an additional body of the same size on the opposing side - but with a smaller radius distance to the shaft. Then, however, one also needs a device which changes the radius distance after 180 ° angle of rotation and also has the disadvantage that almost the entire case work is consumed again for the stroke of the counter mass.

Bessler knew this - in the Middle Ages one had more peace to think about - and therefore he wanted to dispense with the counter masses and use the entire case work of the down-turning imbalance. For this, however, he needed a body with which he could have the mass rolled down.

But where should the body remain until it is needed? Exactly, only in the wheel center was place for it. So Bessler invented the diagonal slider on which the counterweight was fastened, the slider mass with.

The imbalance could not simply stick to the wheel disc, otherwise it would have turned on the other side again upwards and would thus have consumed their entire case work. For this reason Bessler fixed the unbalance weights on a pair of opposing, rotatable arms, which could be moved independently of the angle of rotation of the wheel disc. Now he could use the following program:

1) Unbalance lever pair rotate rigidly with the rotation of the wheel, rotation angle 180 °.

2) At the bottom, release the counterweight from the wheel center and pull the unbalance weights up again as the wheel slowly rotates. Counterweight is then down and the unbalance is up.

3) Turn counterweight wheel on one side and unbalance on the other so far until the unbalance is down again and the counterweight is up.

4) Loosen counterweight in the wheel center and pull the imbalance arms upwards.

This closes the crimping process and the imbalance can make the next case work again in the downward direction ... etc.
daanopperman
Devotee
Devotee
Posts: 1546
Joined: Wed Oct 27, 2010 7:43 pm

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by daanopperman »

Hi jonnynet

I doubt if the author has any understanding of Bessler's wheel , never mind a runner .

The position of the overbalance weight in the wheel is of no concern , it is the loss of pe that has to be re instated .
Whether it is hidden on the axel at some stage , and let down at another , that same weight has to be lifted back to the axel for the next rotation .
But it is heartily good to see the Germans have the same misinterpretation of Bessler's explication of the working principal of the wheel .
jonnynet
Aficionado
Aficionado
Posts: 347
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 8:34 pm
Location: Leipzig, Saxony, Germany

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by jonnynet »

I've translated the first part. The translation result still doesn't satisfy me but I can't do it better, I fear. The last part wasn't posted by Fletcher, which seems to me as the most important one, by the way. Anyways, here's my translation:
If a wheel, such as Bessler’s one, is intended to turn by itself, an imbalance-weight near the circumference is required to provide power* to the shaft during a downward rotation. It isn’t advisable - but also not bad to rise up an additional weight of the same size on the opposing side - with less distance to the shaft. However, then you also need a device which changes the distance to the shaft after a 180° rotation and in addition there’s the disadvantage that almost the entire work* is consumed again for lifting the counterweight.

Bessler was aware of that - in medieval times people had more peace for thinking - and therefore he wanted to dispense with a counterweight while using the entire work being done by the imbalance-weight. But for this, he needed another weight to pull up the weight which was rotated down to the bottom.

But where that weight should remain until it’s needed? Of course, only at the wheel’s center! So Bessler invented the diagonal-slider where the counterweight was attached to, the mass of the slider included.

The imbalance-weight could not simply stick to the wheel disc, otherwise it would have rotated up on the other side again and consumed its entire work*. For this reason, Bessler attached the imbalance-weights to a pair of opposing, rotatable arms, which could be moved independently of the wheel disc’s rotation. Now he could use the following procedure:

1) Rotate down the imbalance-lever-pair rigidly with the rotation of the wheel, 180°.

2) When at the bottom, release the counterweight from the wheel’s center and pull up the imbalance-weights as the wheel slowly continues rotating. The counterweight is then at the bottom and the other one at the top.

3) Continue turning the wheel until weights have changed their positions.

4) Let drop the counterweight in the wheel’s center and finally pull up the imbalance-arms.
*Here I replaced the german word "Fallarbeit" which means the work being done when a mass drops. I couldn’t find an appropriate, single word for that.

I've to admit that the author has some faults in his text. At least he uses different phrases/words meaning the same which can confuse. Especially when translated by computer. Therefore I've not only translated, I tried to correct these phrases and interpret with my own understanding of what he really means.

Please await the other parts, thank you.
User avatar
raj
Addict
Addict
Posts: 2981
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:53 am
Location: Mauritius

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by raj »

After reading carefully the lengthy explanations above, I feel that my AMW concept has some basic similarity, with my pendulum Bobs/weights being referred as imbalanced weight moving downwards and as counterweight when being pulled upwards.

Except my resetting of positions is every 45 degrees turn.

The explanations show what I have been calling asymmetry of torque, time and motion.

Granted that the both the imbalanced weight and the counterweight move up and down the same heights and as such there is no net gain of heights.

The question that remain to be answered is this:

Does the asymmetry of torque, the different angles and Parts and places of application of gravitation force and differing speed of motion separately by the imbalanced weight and the counterweight, MAKE a difference in the overall net torque in this mechanical arrangement.

Raj
Last edited by raj on Thu Aug 17, 2017 10:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
Keep learning till the end.
jonnynet
Aficionado
Aficionado
Posts: 347
Joined: Fri Mar 17, 2006 8:34 pm
Location: Leipzig, Saxony, Germany

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by jonnynet »

I'm done!
The Besslerwheel is clocked. With every revolution it transmits once the imbalance-work completely to the shaft. In order to restore its ability to work, a counterweight is pulled out of the wheel's center and being rotated by 180° in a cycle of equilibrium. After that, the drop height of the imbalance-weight is fully restored. Bessler applies a new 2-point lever to lift back the imbalance-weight with the help of the counterweight. This is actually the true masterpiece of his mechanics. You have to know that if you want to go further.

The Bessler-imbalance consists of two opposing arms which are mounted on the wheel disc pivotable and connected to the counterweight via the 2-point lever mechanism in form of a slotted diagonal-slider.

The problem Bessler had to solve was the fact that the imbalance-arms had to be lifted through the entire diameter of the wheel, but for the counterweight there's only the drop height of the wheel radius available. Bessler had to find a trick to increase the power of the normal 1-point lever on the secondary side...
Today, you would say that the lever generates power where there's none. But according to the laws of torque transmission, the second pivot point of the lever provides the extension of the path on the short, strong lever arm.

This invention has not been discovered a second time till today, even for the simple reason that it apparently contradicts the law of energy conservation - which is, of course, nonsense, so-called "Unifug" (textbook theories taugth at the university) because it's an energy transformation process that takes place on the storage of gravitational energy.

Well, too much studying does not always lead to the goal.
Not always logical at some points and for me there're questions left.

Is there a law of torque transmission? What does he mean with that?

And from the first part: why only almost the entire work should be consumed for lifting the counterweight?
john.smith
Enthusiast
Enthusiast
Posts: 158
Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2017 2:20 pm

Post by john.smith »

It'd be easy enough for me to say it describes what I am building. I'll need to take my time with my build to give it the best chance of working. I don't think I'll need to hurry because my build has been pretty much discredited already. That is my fault for being willing to work openly.
User avatar
raj
Addict
Addict
Posts: 2981
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:53 am
Location: Mauritius

re: German description of BW's working principle from privat

Post by raj »

deleted...
Keep learning till the end.
Post Reply