Has anyone ever done a systematic analysis of the MTs?

[ME]

NB. 1st May, 1733. Due to the arrest, I burned and buried all papers that prove the possibility. However, I have left all demonstrations and experiments, since it would be difficult for anybody to see or learn anything about a perpetual motion from them or to decide whether there was any truth in them because no illustration by itself contains a description of the motion; however, taking various illustrations together and combining them with a discerning mind, it will indeed be possible to look for a movement and, finally to find one in them.

Orffyreus

Apparently it needs an exhaustive search (literally).
From "no motion" to "a motion" till the mind finally sees "one"...

Seems to me Bessler hints at the prime-mover here.

[eccentrically1]

"it runs according to 'preponderance', and turns everything else along with it; as long as its materials shall endure, it will revolve of its own accord" – AP pg 363

"all the wise ones were looking for the same principle (of 'excess weight') that I have described, and they sought it in things that were already familiar to them" – AP pg 366

"by all intelligent people, who, with true understanding, have sought the Mobile in a place no different from that in which I eventually found it" – AP pg 367

First quote confirms that his wheel turns by overbalance and that the energy source does not require replenishment.

Second quote confirms that his wheel turns by overbalance, but that his principle utilises something that 'the wise ones' were not familiar with.

Third quote reaffirms that his wheel was similar to already familiar OOB wheel designs.

In these quotes Bessler describes the similarity between his wheel and classic OOB wheel designs. However, nowhere in these quotes does Bessler dare mention what 'the wise ones' were not familiar with. We know from comments in MT that the missing element is a prime mover (and its source of energy). Once again Bessler seems happy to discuss the weights inside his wheel (he even allowed them to be handled), but he never dares hint about how the weights were actually powered.

There aren’t that many possibilities for power. A simple process that was weak and not commercially viable.

[BesslerInterested]

NB. 1st May, 1733. ...I burned and buried all papers that prove ... [/b].

Orffyreus

1.
I wondered what he meantioning exactly with BURIED?
I would pack The Plans watertight in a box or something, dig a hole, somewhere which Nobody knows, put it in there and Cover iit up again.
Maybe all to reveal The Mysterie is ground Penetration Radar and some extensive Research about The whereabouts of Those BURIED Papiers.
Any Bessler Experts here are able to give Detail Information, where Bessler lived before and After his Arrest, Around the Time of May, 1st, 1733?

The Website Dictionary.com States following:
bury[ber-ee]
SYNONYMS|EXAMPLES|WORD ORIGIN|IDIOMSSEE MORE SYNONYMS FOR bury ON THESAURUS.COM
verb (used with object), bur·ied, bur·y·ing.

1.to put in the ground and cover with earth:
The pirates buried the chest on the island.

2.to put (a corpse) in the ground or a vault, or into the sea, often with ceremony:
They buried the sailor with full military honors.

3.to plunge in deeply; cause to sink in:
to bury an arrow in a target.

4.to cover in order to conceal from sight:
She buried the card in the deck.

5.to immerse (oneself):
He buried himself in his work.


1.2.
Pablo escobar used to Hide stuff in his House, under The floor.
I saw this in the documentary hunting escobars millions.
I Imagine Bessler could have done The Same thing.
Think about it: he doesnt have to step Outside, and not having The danger of anyone spotting him, hiding his Secret.
He also Build a windmill, maybe he put it under The foundation of The Windmill, what a coincidence that would be, huh?

2.
He also writes in one of his books (maybe someone Can help out where exactly) that somewhere near where he lived, he put one of his Wheels on a Water pumping Wheel, to keep The Water continously pumping.
This Water Wheel and The exactly Location also Never was revealed to my Knowledge, or has he somewhere given more Information about it?
It probably still is going strong, i could Imagine!
Maybe somewhere in The Undergrounds of The Castle from Karl Hessen, which Bessler Showed The Secret, and felt Save?
But als i remember it, he installed The wheel on The Water Pump, before he showed Carl his Secret, which would rule out this Place as a possibility.

[John Collins]

Bessler lived in Karlshafen after leaving Kassel. He also began work building a vertical axle windmill in Furstenberg from which he fall to his death. His tomb was placed in his garden, which is now covered by tarmac and is a carpark.

As can be seen of the first page of MT, the writing is extremely difficult to read and I can’t rule out a mis-translation of the actual words used. So do not place too much faith in the translation. Although I cannot read it myself, I think a more likely word would have been ‘hid’, so the sentence would read ‘I burned or hid all papers...’.

Also don’t forget we have the whole of MT, plus his comment above, so I suspect the missing papers are either there in MT, or missing.

JC

[ovaron]

"NB. 1733 den ersten May habe wegen des Arrests alle die Formen verbrannt, welche jetzt vergraben, und welche die Möglichkeit demonstrieren…."

My translation would be:
I burned all moldings, which are now buried, that prove …

[John Collins]

Thank you, Ovaron.

JC

[Georg Künstler]

I would translate it a little bit different, but the meaning will be the same.

NB. In 1733 the first of May, because of the arrest, I burned all the forms, models, that are now buried, and which demonstrate the possibility .... "

Result: So no piece which can demonstrate the possibility is left.

[FunWithGravity2]

I believe MT1 is the most important and should be built by anyone commencing on the journey. I believe the assumed play on words is a misdirection that JB relished in the fact that he will lead you down the wrong path just like so many others because the fatal flaw that he saw in MT1 was not what everyone else sees.

He then shows you MT2 and continues to lead down the path that everyone else has by changing what they believe to be the problem. He then plays with you pointing out the obviousness that we all assume to be the defining issue with each MT.


Crazy Dave

[ME]

NB. 1st May, 1733. ...I burned and buried all papers that prove ... [/b].

Orffyreus

1.
I wondered what he meantioning exactly with BURIED?
I would pack The Plans watertight in a box or something, dig a hole, somewhere which Nobody knows, put it in there and Cover iit up again.
Maybe all to reveal The Mysterie is ground Penetration Radar and some extensive Research about The whereabouts of Those BURIED Papiers.
Any Bessler Experts here are able to give Detail Information, where Bessler lived before and After his Arrest, Around the Time of May, 1st, 1733?

The Website Dictionary.com States following:
bury[ber-ee]
SYNONYMS|EXAMPLES|WORD ORIGIN|IDIOMSSEE MORE SYNONYMS FOR bury ON THESAURUS.COM
verb (used with object), bur·ied, bur·y·ing.

1.to put in the ground and cover with earth:
The pirates buried the chest on the island.

2.to put (a corpse) in the ground or a vault, or into the sea, often with ceremony:
They buried the sailor with full military honors.

3.to plunge in deeply; cause to sink in:
to bury an arrow in a target.

4.to cover in order to conceal from sight:
She buried the card in the deck.

5.to immerse (oneself):
He buried himself in his work.


1.2.
Pablo escobar used to Hide stuff in his House, under The floor.
I saw this in the documentary hunting escobars millions.
I Imagine Bessler could have done The Same thing.
Think about it: he doesnt have to step Outside, and not having The danger of anyone spotting him, hiding his Secret.
He also Build a windmill, maybe he put it under The foundation of The Windmill, what a coincidence that would be, huh?

<snip>
http://www.besslerwheel.com/forum/viewt ... 690#164690

This kid, dug up a whooping 1.5 years old timecapsule... https://youtu.be/mDLDiJfnFbg

What the heck!

LoL.
Let's give it some views, if only just to counter-creep!! [see 7:15]

Here another (50 yr):https://youtu.be/jaJOOaZLx4s
The result is bad!

Now imagine: 300+ years and the continental climate...
Unless there's evidence of some special (dry enough) storage place, I suppose one could be fairly sure any possible 'ground work' is just gone.

[silent]

.

[Fletcher]

1."it runs according to 'preponderance', and turns everything else along with it; as long as its materials shall endure, it will revolve of its own accord" – AP pg 363

2. "all the wise ones were looking for the same principle (of 'excess weight') that I have described, and they sought it in things that were already familiar to them" – AP pg 366

3."by all intelligent people, who, with true understanding, have sought the Mobile in a place no different from that in which I eventually found it" – AP pg 367

1. First quote confirms that his wheel turns by overbalance and that the energy source does not require replenishment.

2. Second quote confirms that his wheel turns by overbalance, but that his principle utilises something that 'the wise ones' were not familiar with.

3. Third quote reaffirms that his wheel was similar to already familiar OOB wheel designs.

In these quotes Bessler describes the similarity between his wheel and classic OOB wheel designs. However, nowhere in these quotes does Bessler dare mention what 'the wise ones' were not familiar with.

We know from comments in MT that the missing element is a prime mover (and its source of energy). Once again Bessler seems happy to discuss the weights inside his wheel (he even allowed them to be handled), but he never dares hint about how the weights were actually powered.

My comments and opinions :

1.The first quote says ‘the wheel’ runs according to the mechanical principle of everlasting preponderance i.e. excess positive torque, asymmetric torque.

Meaning of Preponderance: noun .. the quality or fact of being greater in number, quantity, or importance.

2.The second quote says that ALL the wise ones were looking for the same principle (of excess weight; aka excess impetus, preponderance, excess positive torque, asymmetric torque). They experimented with mechanical arrangements familiar to them, whilst Bessler implies he went further into the unfamiliar to find his mechanical principle of excess positive torque.

3.The third quote says that Bessler found his principle that lead to his PMM solution in the same place as those with intelligence and true understanding had looked. That being the OOB wheel concept. This can seem a contradictory thing to say in light of the above statements. It can however mean something else imo. That an OOB wheel (the equal positive and negative torques proposition i.e. the symmetric torque OOB wheel) was a part of the mechanical preponderance solution to a PM wheel but was not used in its known capacity to generate symmetric torque, that all the intelligent, wise, and those of true understanding had previously been familiar with and used it for, with a resounding lack of success. IOW’s they did not understand the problem and kept falling back on the familiar but ultimate failures. Bessler employed the OOB wheel for an entirely different purpose, whose alternate function did contribute to success.

[Georg Künstler]

Fletcher Wrote:

My comments and opinions :

1.The first quote says ‘the wheel’ runs according to the mechanical principle of everlasting preponderance i.e. excess positive torque, asymmetric torque.

Meaning of Preponderance: noun .. the quality or fact of being greater in number, quantity, or importance.

2.The second quote says that ALL the wise ones were looking for the same principle (of excess weight; aka excess impetus, preponderance, excess positive torque, asymmetric torque). They experimented with mechanical arrangements familiar to them, whilst Bessler implies he went further into the unfamiliar to find his mechanical principle of excess positive torque.

3.The third quote says that Bessler found his principle that lead to his PMM solution in the same place as those with intelligence and true understanding had looked. That being the OOB wheel concept. This can seem a contradictory thing to say in light of the above statements. It can however mean something else imo. That an OOB wheel (the equal positive and negative torques proposition i.e. the symmetric torque OOB wheel) was a part of the mechanical preponderance solution to a PM wheel but was not used in its known capacity to generate symmetric torque, that all the intelligent, wise, and those of true understanding had previously been familiar with and used it for, with a resounding lack of success. IOW’s they did not understand the problem and kept falling back on the familiar but ultimate failures. Bessler employed the OOB wheel for an entirely different purpose, whose alternate function did contribute to success.

I agree with point one.
nevertheless this point is different to that what Bessler said that the wheel is well balanced.
You have two sayings which obviously do not match.
they do not match in the first view, but if you look closer into the two sentences, and add the 8 impacts heard, then you can combine the wording and the action.
The wheel is well balanced, the internal impact arrange the weights in that way so that it creates an assymetric torque.

All the wise ones are looking in the same direction of an overbalanced wheel, but Besslers wheel is well balanced and only overbalanced if in motion.
Swinging is the key.
Exactly it is tilt swing.

[AB Hammer]

Georg Kunstler
You said, but Besslers wheel is well balanced and only overbalanced if in motion.

The first one stayed in overbalance mode from what I read. The bidirectional wheels needed a nudge for which direction needed.

[ovyyus]

"First impressions by lamplight...

'Lamplight' is an incorrect translation which should read 'lampblack'. Lampblack is an easily made print block ink made from carbon or soot.

https://www.instructables.com/id/Lampblack/

[Fletcher]

Fletcher Wrote:

My comments and opinions :

1.The first quote says ‘the wheel’ runs according to the mechanical principle of everlasting preponderance i.e. excess positive torque, asymmetric torque.

Meaning of Preponderance: noun .. the quality or fact of being greater in number, quantity, or importance.

.. snip ..

I agree with point one.

Nevertheless this point is different to that what Bessler said that the wheel is well balanced.

You have two sayings which obviously do not match.

.. snip ..

Only Bessler's bi_directional wheels were balanced (zero or neutralized torque) when stationary. They required a push start in any direction and then accelerated to rpm.

So if there is an everlasting (until it breaks) preponderance principle (net positive torque one direction) in play for a uni-directional wheel, then it means to me that each OOB mechanics (for the two-way wheels) had its own Prime Mover attachment. And they both had opposite preponderances which was initially manifest as balanced torque when stationary. After forced rotation it seems plausible that one Prime Mover was disengaged, or neutralized if you prefer. Thus allowing a preponderance to operate in the direction of rotation.

Georg .. I look forward to your rebuild, then we can all debate the relative merits you discuss. Good luck.