Bessler's axle?

[Ben]

I notice that most of the drawings show arms passing through the center of the axle. Bessler describes the axle as being 8" in diameter. Maybe the "movable or elastic arms" should be outside that area?.

[rlortie]

Ben,

Welcome to the forum!

To my knowledge your are the first joining member to hit us with a picture of your failure. Nice art work though, and a good show of craftsmanship. Sure does more for the soul than a computer simulation.

Yes I am lead to believe that Bessler's axle was 8" in diameter. If I recall correctly he also said that it had holes and/or compartments in it. This leads me to believe that it was of hollow construction not unlike a coopered barrel or wooden pipe that were both common in his day.

Hang in there, I am a hands on type myself and always glad to meet a peer.

Ralph

[AB Hammer]

Greeting Ben
And welcome to the forum

Nicely built, but you know you are going to start a trend. So I guess I will follow with my first non worker. I believe that the term "Non Worker" should be the term that best describes them. Some people say failure but never use failure for we always learn from them.

So here is my first Non Worker, minus the guts that where in it, I was showing Buddy (the man I use part of his shop and who got me going on these) why a self cocking hammer wasn't going to work. If you look closely you can see a drawing.

[Fletcher]

Hi Ben .. I recently made my own coopered barrel internal axle [around 6 inches in diameter, as the whole wheel is only 5 foot or so]. The reason being that my test wheel doesn't normally have an internal axle & I needed to create one so I had something to anchor my experimental 'superior overbalancing' system too. I had to make the axle circumference that big to give room for 8 mechs to have limited range of movement about their individual pivot attachments at the axle. Because the wheel is quite thin this meant that the attachments were in the same plane [& why I needed the larger circumference] & not offset/staggered, as you could do with a larger width wheel perhaps. Following on form Ralph's observations, mine is hollow, as its purpose is providing structural strength & anchoring points for mechs.

Before I made it I went thru the options of making an octagonal shaped piece of solid wood [that would have suited me also] but it did cause me to reflect of Besslers 8" axle. Making it solid seemed easy enough but to then have to center bore it afterwards to snuggley fit a 3/4" iron axle seemed to prone to errors creeping in [& straining noise later]. This may be what Bessler did but imo I think it was unlikely. I think he may have made it in pieces where he hollowed out an axle groove in each segment & then glued & screwed them together. For me the circumference was important & not the space inside so I simply made it out of decking timber cut down & angled on my compound mitre saw.

So it wouldn't surprize me if Besslers axle wasn't solid all the way thru & that was why he could reuse it over & over & it could have holes & compartments/grooves in it - possibly the iron center axle was the main load bearing axle & it didn't rely on the extra support from the wooden axle casing. If that were the case then as you speculate, its purpose could well be for attachment of "moveable or elastic" arms or other types of internal mechs.

Nice build btw.

[MrTim]

Could it be that the "holes and compartments" in his axle were where the wheel framework was attached? (It has to be fit on somehow!) By re-using an axle for different wheels, you'd end up with unused holes.
More areas to research... ;)

[Fletcher]

I'm sure it was also used as twin hubs [for spoke/frame attachment] - like wagon wheels have spokes attached - that then leaves the question were they 8" all the way across ? - I think so - that way you get a good solid relatively inflexible frame that can take great weight if required without deforming much at all, if any - now, some will rely solely on the rim cross members for this structural integrity but my previous experience has shown me that when any great weight is supported from the axle [not part of the frame rigidity] there is a tendency for bowing to occur in the side members - that is assuming you don't want other mid radius cross members which would limit movement of components within the wheel - JMO's.

[Ben]

I think the reasons he had holes and compartments in the (i think) wheel, not the axle, is that he couldn't buy sheet of plywood.

[Ben]

But then again, think how much easier it is to cut holes in plywood (so you can see what isn't happening) than to build an 11 foot wheel out of sticks, with probably greater visibility.

[rlortie]

I think the reasons he had holes and compartments in the (i think) wheel, not the axle, is that he couldn't buy sheet of plywood.

Sorry Ben, but his first wheel was covered with veneer. The statement of holes and compartments applied to the axle as I recall.

As I have posted before the word "veneer" is somewhat a pun. In German it means to cover or camouflage.

Ralph

[Bessler007]

Hello Ben,

If you added up the time and material of your wheel how much would you guess you have in it? I would guess $150 in material and about 20 hours. 20 hours @ $20/hour would put it at $550. Is that close?

[Ben]

"Ask any of those who have groped inside my Wheel and grasped its axle" - "Rather, it has many compartments, and is pierced all over with various holes." - pg 336

Maybe refers to the axle, maybe refers to the wheel.

Please, I don't want to cause trouble. It's just that the wheel I posted is far from my first non-worker, try ten years worth of non workers. If there is one thing i have learned it is that gravity can compensate with the same speed as anything you can throw at it. My idea is that if maybe we roll it over a barrel, so to speak, maybe we can make something happen before gravity can compensate for it.

[Ben]

More than $550. I'm not that cheap. What doesn't show in the photo is the steel ball bearing on the axle and the roller blade bearings on the arms (they're just on the other side of the dowel ends you can see.

[Ben]

If i had to build another one, maybe, but figuring out how to build a prototype non worker is expensive.

[Bessler007]

I've built quite a few wheels. I've also tested quite a few ideas. I've concluded it makes more sense to spend time analyzing an idea before testing it and it makes even more sense to test every idea you think is in your wheel before building it completely. You might say I've evolved from 'hands on' to 'mind on'.

Leverage over an axle seems to me to be about the same as attached to the perimeter. Why would the torque over an axle be different from that developed at the perimeter?

I do agree it's hard to keep up with gravity. :)

[Ben]

time, it gives you time------------maybe, I don't know, but i wore out the center axle with levers trying to push the other side over, hinged and weighted clapper arms attatched, enough time spent for more than one divorce,but fortunately she keeps me. But it seems that as a weight spins over a barrel, it is temporarily out of gravity's control, that is from side to side. Up and down, gravity. Side to side, Besslerwheel.com--------maybe. I'll be working tomorrow on the fourth generation from the wheel posted(built six months ago), and I have had some good results, like seeing gravitational force applied at certain points of rotation as the thing slows down. The trouble is, so far, it slows down.


This is embarrassing. I've been reading posts for years and never knew I had so much to say. I'm pretty much the quiet type. Thanks for all your responses. This is a really nice community of smart people.