"so simple a carpenter's boy could make it"

[tomfleet]

Hi everyone,
I've come across this statement many times, to the effect that Prince Karl observed that the mechanism was so simple a carpenter's boy could build it. Is there available, anywhere, the original text of the contemporaneous letter, or whatever it is, written by whomever, in which the statement is recorded? I've tried googling, this forum and the web. I apologize in advance if it's right in front of me, or in John Collins' book. I mean the actual original statement (ideally in context, with surrounding text), rather than a translation, paraphrase or summary.

Also, is anyone aware of any contemporaneous record of observation of the wreckage of any wheel after Bessler destroyed it?

Thank you,
Tom

[John Collins]

The statement comes from Joseph Fischer, the son of Johann Bernhard Fischer von Erlach, a famous Austrian architect, sculptor and architectural historian. He carried out a number of tests on the wheel and wrote to Desaguliers, Sir Isaac Newton's curator of experiments. The quote is as follows:-

"His Highness, who has a perfect understanding of mathematics, assured me that the machine is so simple that a carpenter's boy could understand and make it after having seen the inside of this wheel, and that he would not risk his name in giving these attestations, if he did not have knowledge of the machine."

The letter is extant.

JC

[tomfleet]

Thank you.

If anyone has, or can point me to, a copy or transcript of the original passage, in context in the actual letter--rather than a translation or paraphrase--, I'd be grateful if they could post it here. I suppose it is in Latin or German. I know of no reason to doubt the translation that's been offered, merely I'm wedded to reading things in the original if I can, and I'm curious about any statements surrounding the text at issue.

Thanks,

Tom

[John Collins]

OK Tom, here is your passage in its original wording. The French is not very good but Fischer was Austrian and had already spent a couple of years in England and spoke good English and clearly had learned some French too.

"Son altesse qui possede parfaitement les mathematiques , m'assure que cette machine est si facile qu'un garcon de menuisier la fauroit comprendre, & la faire apres avoir vu le dedans de cette Roue, & qu'il n'auroit pas expose son nom en donnant des attestations, s'il n'avoit pas eu connaisance de la machine."

"Menuisier" means joiner, furniture make etc.

I have a copy of the whole letter.

Hope this helps.

JC

[Stewart]

Hi John

Looks like the original text matches the translation. I've noticed a transcription error though - 'fauroit' should be 'sauroit'. Also, for those who want to try running it through a modern translator, you'll need to change the old -oit endings to modern -ait endings and put in the missing accents as follows:

"Son altesse qui possède parfaitement les mathématiques , m'assure que cette machine est si facile qu'un garçon de menuisier la saurait comprendre, & la faire après avoir vu le dedans de cette Roue, & qu'il n'aurait pas exposé son nom en donnant des attestations, s'il n'avait pas eu connaissance de la machine."

Is the copy of the letter that you have a scan of the original handwriting or a transcription, and if it's the original would you be prepared to send me a copy please?

All the best
Stewart

[John Collins]

Quite right Stewart and I forgot to add that I was unable to include the accents which were in the original!

I think I have a copy of the original which I can send you, but the one I used was published by William Kenrick in 1770. Give me a week or so as I am otherwise engaged for a week or so. Maybe you could remind me if you don't hear from me. I think everyone knows about my lousy memory by now. ;-)

JC

[Jon J Hutton]

Does anyone know what was written about the wreckage of the wheel? Stewart, I think mentioned in a post IIRC that he had the note on that, or it could of been John ( so much for my memory).

John, If we had better memories there would be many more fights on this board.

JJH

[Stewart]

I think I have a copy of the original which I can send you, but the one I used was published by William Kenrick in 1770. Give me a week or so as I am otherwise engaged for a week or so. Maybe you could remind me if you don't hear from me. I think everyone knows about my lousy memory by now. ;-)

Thanks John, I'd be grateful for a copy but there's no hurry - I wouldn't want to be accused of distracting you from your current wheel build! I'll give you a gentle reminder in a few weeks maybe. :-)

Stewart