4 weights lifting one

[AB Hammer]

Alexioco

Greetings and welcome to the forum. If you are going to post your design post it on Community Buzz so that only members can see to help and the wrong eyes can't see. That is what I have done with the ones I have posted.

[Alexioco]

Hey, Nice to see you, since i last spoke to you this amasing idea came to me... hope i can get it built soon

[Alexioco]

Ok I am starting the wheel right now, im going to keep this updated by editing this, quite abit should be done with some time...

To do:

1. Wheel
2. Wheel Rim
3. Pegs fixed on wheel
4. Weigted Springs fixed to wheel
5. Stoppers


What I've Done

1. Wheel
2. Wheel Rim
3. Pegs fixed on wheel
4. Weigted Springs fixed to wheel
5.

Ok, the wheel is nearly finished, the stoppers have to be fixed in "If I can figure out how to make them out of card" But without the stoppers the wheel can not be perpetual but the wheel does indeed move until the stoppers have to take their action which they can't be they aren’t there... This may take awhile...

[AB Hammer]

Greetings

OK I didn't recognize you as Alexioco, I am looking forward to seeing what you have come up with.

[Alexioco]

Yup, it’s me :P
Yeah, the only thing that bothers me is this: The wheel is so simple it wont surprise me if its already been tried, but then again, I have never seen this idea in all of the wheels i have looked at, can you recall any wheels that keep four weights on the right and one on the left?

[jim_mich]

can you recall any wheels that keep four weights on the right and one on the left?

The important word here is 'keep'. For this to happen the one on the left must rise four times as fast as the ones on the right fall. Four weights falling at a speed of one will always equal one weight rising at a speed of four.

It's not a matter of keeping a large amount of weight on one side. It is a matter of getting the weight to rise back up while also making the wheel out of balance. It is my opinion that it cannot be done using only gravity. Something must add energy to the weights' movement in order to cause the wheel to output extra energy. Gravity always equals out on both sides when leverage is used.


Edit: "left fall." changed to "right fall." It seems I can't tell my right from my left! :))

[Alexioco]

That's very true, but the weight that moves up only has to move once in order to keep their position, and that movent is done by gravity, if i say anymore you will work this out lol

[jim_mich]

It is not a matter of how often a weight rises but rather how fast it must rise. If one weight rises from bottom to top then one weight must fall from top to bottom during the same time. Or four weights must fall 1/4 of the way to the bottom with the rising weight moving at four times the speed of the falling weights. Rising and falling weights always balance. This is why perpetual motion wheels that use rising and falling weights are considered impossible.

Many would-be Mobile-makers think that if they can arrange for some of the weights to be a little more distant from the center than the others, then the thing will surely revolve. A few years ago, I learned all about this the hard way. And then the truth of the old proverb came home to me that one has to learn through bitter experience.

The same is true with many weights causing a few weights to rise.

[Alexioco]

My weights do not go close to the axel at any time, also the one weight that shifts is not the weight on the left, a different weight moves in order for it to retain its position because as the weights on the right push down the left weight is going up equal to speed while a another weight does a movement in order to sustain this perpetual position...
and its all in law with gravity

[axel]

Alexiocomico,

I know your effort here will fail because Bessler said there was only one pm solution and your's isn't it.

1.
2.
3.
4.
5.

6. Equalibrium (not an element on the periodic chart)

[Alexioco]

Ok, well I respect your answer and infact I dont want to say 100% that it will work myself, i will just have to make it and find out...

[KAS]

It is not a matter of how often a weight rises but rather how fast it must rise. If one weight rises from bottom to top then one weight must fall from top to bottom during the same time. Or four weights must fall 1/4 of the way to the bottom with the rising weight moving at four times the speed of the falling weights. Rising and falling weights always balance. This is why perpetual motion wheels that use rising and falling weights are considered impossible.

Jim, I agree, it would appear impossible.
But I would like to present you with a "what if" scenario.

Some time ago I designed a 4 weight system where the levers enabled 3 weights to dwell on the descent whilst slowly extending their radius, and 1 weight raising at great speed on the ascent.
At the point in time when the single rising weight passed the 12 o'clock (just above the axle) another weight at 6 o'clock would start to speed up and ascend.

The profile was always 3 on one side (extending their radius) and 1 on the other side (decreasing its radius whilst ascending).

It works perfectly on WM2D, slowly increasing in velocity, but I assumed it was just a glitch. I haven't made a physical model yet. Do you think its worth a go?.

Kas

[Alexioco]

I think it is, yes, go for it, also I'm going to post my wheel on comunity buzz so we can all talk about it...

[axel]

"Some time ago I designed a 4 weight system where the levers enabled 3 weights to dwell on the descent whilst slowly extending their radius, and 1 weight raising at great speed on the ascent.
At the point in time when the single rising weight passed the 12 o'clock (just above the axle) another weight at 6 o'clock would start to speed up and ascend.

The profile was always 3 on one side (extending their radius) and 1 on the other side (decreasing its radius whilst ascending).

It works perfectly on WM2D, slowly increasing in velocity, but I assumed it was just a glitch. I haven't made a physical model yet. Do you think its worth a go?."

Kas


Kas,

As I said to Alex.., about his 4-1 weight machine, I will say the same to you sir. It doesn't matter how many weights you employ on one side or the other, as yours is also a dead-ender.

Also, anything depending on centrifugal force is a dead ender.

If you all put out your designs and have me shoot them down, then over time, you may narrow the list of possibilities that way. LOL.

[Dave]

axel
You would have shot down Bessler's idea too!
What is your theory?